Monday, December 14, 2015

Partners to help Air Serbia with transatlantic flights

Air Serbia to use "infrastructure of other airlines" for New York service

Etihad Airways and Alitalia will both provide support to Air Serbia for its planned flights to New York next year, the President and CEO of the Emirati carrier, James Hogan, has said. Furthermore, Air Serbia plans utilise an aircraft from a partner airline for its upcoming transatlantic service. "They’ve [Air Serbia] just announced that they’re going to operate from June from Belgrade to New York. They could not have even introduced that because they’re taking an aircraft from the family. They have to introduce a whole fleet management group. Alitalia is doing the pilot training. We’ll do the cabin-service training. So they’re able to operate a virtual service using the infrastructure of the other airlines. Structurally, we continue to work on how we get economies of scales collectively", Mr Hogan said. Previously, he noted, "Another advantage is that we have so many Serbians at Etihad, we will be able to bring Serbians back into Air Serbia that have long haul experience, because you have to have experience within your cabin crew ratio".

Air Serbia is considering lease options for the A330-200 with Etihad Airways Partner airlines, with Jet Airways the likely source of the jet. Mr Hogan underlined the importance the partnership is having on the Serbian carrier. "As a group we operate 700 aircraft. That means you can take Air Serbia with ten A320s that we’re able to get the price of A320s at our price, which they would never have gotten as a standalone airline. Air Serbia is profitable and doing well". Mr Hogan noted that while 2016 will be a strong year for Etihad itself, its growth in Europe will be minimal. "In our five-year plan, our growth is mainly in China and Africa. China, within our network group, is very important. The market's opening and people are travelling", he said.

Air Serbia, which is undergoing the Federal Aviation Administration's 129 certification process in order to commence services to the United States, has again reiterated its commitment to launch transatlantic flights. The airline's CEO, Dane Kandić, told the December issue of the "Elevate" magazine, "In June, and subject to regulatory approval, we are going to launch a flight that people in the region have been waiting for since 1992. We are going to reconnect Belgrade and New York". He added, "Our plan is to operate five weekly flights to New York on a modern Airbus A330 aircraft. On the other two days, we will offer codeshare connections with our close partner Air Berlin. The service will make travel incredibly more convenient between the United States and the region, and it will also underline how much we are growing".

101 comments:

  1. I'm just wondering whether they will be charged for all these services (training, planes etc) My guess is yes

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    1. Why would they be charged?

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    2. It would be absolutely outrageous if other airlines spend time and money training your pilots and crew, and charges you for the privilege. Scandalous!

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    3. Yes, pure altruism.

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    4. Of course they will be charged. But the money will "stay in the family" because all support will be provided by Etihad partner airlines. At some point ASL may also be able to support someone from the group and earn some money.

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    5. JU already does that: they provide call center activities for Etihad Regional.

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    6. Such arrangements are very common among sister companies. I can’t guarantee it but I wouldn’t be surprised that partners (especially EY) charge JU gets charged less than what the market price is. I worked for several large multinationals (albeit not in the aviation sector) but they all had separate price book for the internal and external customers. So, contrary to Purger’s opinion (whose views I respect very much) I believe that overall JU is benefiting pays less for crew training to EY than what it would cost them with LH for example. To me this also makes business sense since EY owns 49% of JU. So if they charge them more, that get reflected in JU’s books as a lower profit or higher loss margin which undermines their equity value with basically no net financial benefit for them (gubis na mostu a dobijas na cupriji)

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  2. Zaista sa nestrpljenjem ocekuje se taj dan
    poletanja Er Srbije na let preko Atlantika. Gotovo cetvrt veka je dovoljno da vidimo taj dan. Bice velicanstven, u to nemoze biti sumnje. To jeste izvesno, sigurno ostvaruje se. Da je Blagoslovljena Nova 2016 Godina.
    Srecno Er Srbijo. Let take of✈!
    Rodney & Suporters✈✈✈. LYKV✈SYD.

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    1. Nothing is sigurno until all the dozvole are obtained and the first plane takes off from BEG. Everything else is just prazne slame.

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    2. Fully agree with anonymous @221. Once the aircraft leaves Beg airport, then we shall kmow for sure there are flights. Question to be answered would be for how long will these flights last? If there was any money to be made ( and I mean a good return ), the flights would have occurred much sooner. Another thing I do believe is political. They may be watching the situation in the balkans ( don't want to get into that).

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    3. I bet its great to be you :) First, I bet you were saying that werent any chances of having flights to States. Now, since its getting closer, you're waiting for the plane to take off to be sure that there will be flights to States. When the plane takes off, I bet your comments are going to be: "not gonna last long" and so on. Google Paranoia

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    4. And what will you say if for whatever reason there are no flights, or very short lived? What will you says then, tough guy?

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  3. Na taj dan cemo se oprostiti od mnogobrojih pratilaca ovog bloga koji ce pociniti seppuku. Tuzno.

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    1. Nece svi,siguran sam da ce ostati dosta njih koji ce naredne 2 god da pisu koliko asl gubi para i predvidjaju kataklizmu nevidjenih razmera na brdovitom Balkanu

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    2. A ne, sve je med i mleko u AS?

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    3. Nema potrebe da sve bude med i mleko jer čak i kada bi bilo tako vi hejteri biste opet pronašli neki razlog da taj med i mleko mrzite iz dna duše. Dovoljno je samo na pripada vašoj političkoj opciji/partiji i to je to. Prema tome, neka je ovakva kakva je, nema svrhe ulagati u med i mleko i prosipati ga pred profesionalne politikante.

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    4. Moj standard je med i mleko, sve drugo ne dolazi u obzir. I vi koji samo hvale AS, probajte samo malo da kritički gledate celu stvar, a ne kao INN-SNS

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    5. @8:16
      1) Standard ti je blago rečeno nerealan i moraš malo da smanjiš očekivanja kako bi izbegavao česta razočarenja, kako na ovom blogu tako i u životu.
      2) A vi koji samo znate da pljujete i šatro kritikujete bi mogli da nadjete hobi ili ponekad ne razmišljate o svemu kao da je apokalipsa i kao da je sve užasno pod maskom nekog kriticizma.

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  4. Wait remember reading people's comments here how Etihad has given up on Air Serbia, how US flights won't even start, how the apocalypse is near because BEG airport saw passenger decline in November...

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    1. I don't recall ever reading here comments about Etihad giving up on Air Serbia, but a number of people have suggested that Air Serbia will be bleeding money with this route. It sounds plausible.

      In the meantime, you go raise false accusations and shoot them down yourself so that it makes you feel better.

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    2. It is absolutely true. Many people have said how it looks like Etihad is giving up on Air Serbia.

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    3. Since the very start of the Air Serbia project, people have been predicting doom and an imminent collapse. Air Serbia has so far risen and conquered every challenge.

      Before, Air Serbia used to have big issues with on-time performance, and often flights were delayed by hours. This has greatly died down and now Air Serbia is beyond average.

      Also, people on this very site were constantly writing about how Air Serbia had a low load factor, but it has gotten better and the LF is still rising.

      And when ASL was still setting up, so many people were claiming that the low fares meant that ASL was soon to collapse and that the pax would go away once the fares were raised. Now ASL has reasonable yields.

      Having a negative outlook is absolutely fine, but it is disgusting when this outlook is motivated by hatred.

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    4. Za razliku od drugih akvizicijama gde sagorevaju pare lopatama troskovi sanacije JATa su simbolicni.

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    5. I don't recall, certainly not by many. Though I don't exclude the possibility of people right such nonsense, why go down to their level?

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    6. A3, yes, it was a very common topic on this site when EY bought Alitalia. Some people claimed that EY was giving up on ASL..

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    7. The very moment ASL announced the first route downgrade, this blog was flooded with "hahaha, money ran out, Etihad giving up, hahaha" comments.

      And even while ASL was in full expansion (2014) and announcing new routes every week or so, Purger for example kept on insisting how all this dumping will stop very soon and then Etihad will give up because they will have bigger worries.

      Even when Etihad added new airlines to their alliance (Alitalia) it was immediately interpreted (by Purger of course) as a sign of imminent give up on ASL because Etihad would be so much overwhelmed with loss-making Alitalia and AirBerlin, they wouldn not even look at ASL anymore.

      If nothing else, Alitalia was often used as a key argument that ASL will never ever go transatlantic because Etihad will funnel everything through FCO.

      And now that all these expert predictions turned out to be nonsense, we can only sit and wait to see what will come next. Because the doom&gloom tam neither can admit they were wrong nor they can stop bashing (hate is a vicious motivator).

      Not sure I understand why people get some things so seriously and as if their own lives directly depend on whether an exYU airline will be a success or not. But it is the mentality of this region.

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    8. You do realise that it's only JFK that was announced after the major network cuts? It's not like JU is bouncing back. Reality check, please.

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    9. Anon 11:25,

      1. Bouncing back from what? JU has a double-digit growth of pax in 2015 and the LF/yields grow too.

      2. No one said anything about bouncing back. We were commenting this nonsense about "Etihad giving up on ASL".

      As for reality check, you may wish to recommend it to those who scream out of happiness each time JU decides to optimize its network and capacity. ALL FLIGHTS DELAYED, ALL FLIGHTS DELAYED, MAJOR NETWORK CUTS, MAJOR NETWORK CUTS, ETIHAD GIVING UP, ETIHAD GIVING UP...

      Yeah, reality...

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    10. Alitalia opened new routes and lot of long-haul flights.

      In same time Air Serbia cuts 13% of their flights, close some routes, did not open any new one, plan for flights to USA was cut from 2 planes to one, and three routes to just one with 5 flights per week. Dumping is finished, ticket prices are high. Belgrade airport postponed to an undefined period terminal reconstruction and expansion.

      So there is no more money for dumping and supporting of unreal frequencies, connection is very bad. And you are still so optimistic?

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    11. Compare how many flights/routes Air Serbia launched from 2013 and how much passenger numbers have grown since October 2013. You are also comparing the Italian market with the Serbian one which is incomparable by all means.

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    12. Sad ste nasli da se bunite protiv pojedinaca niste to smeli dok vesti nisu konacno objavljene ?
      Ponekad sam jedini ja ovde branio ASL i niko od vas nije smeo , pa ne znam cemu sad nerviranje.
      INN-NS

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    13. Anon 11:36,

      Let me repeat once more:

      Air Serbia has a double-digit growth of passengers in 2015.

      Keywords: double.digit.passenger.growth

      In addition, Air Serbia's LF and yields are also on the increase in 2015.

      Keywords: LF.yields.increase

      Now back to your question: no, I am not so optimistic. I am curious in how the entire project will go. I watch it, I taste it here and there, I read about it, you know, general curiosity without too much emotions.

      What I also don't have is this obsessive desire that Air Serbia fails. And I am happy I don't because this obsession apparently twists a person's senses and cognitive abilities so badly, it turns them into blind screamers of pure hate. A bit scary and it seems to have no cure.

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    14. James Hogan has medicine for that.

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    15. I don't understand why some people on this blog must have enemies all the time. I also cannot understand that you don't see I support Air Serbia project and that I am only sorry why our Minster and CTN CEO was not listen to me when I present them almost similar plan in 2010. Also let me remind you that when Etihad came in JU I said „You are blessed, don't destroy it like Air Bosna destroy deal with Turkish“.

      1. I did say that dumping will stop. Didn't have idea it will stop so early. But here is the fact. Prices are much higher today than it was 2 months ago (most of the routes even 100% more) and there was big cut in frequencies and routes. So, yes, I was right. Was dumping stupid idea? NO! Was stupid to stop it in winter 2015? Of course not! But one more time I told there would be more money for dumping and that it will be on till winter 2016 to support JFK route.

      2. „Even when Etihad added new airlines to their alliance (Alitalia) it was immediately interpreted (by Purger of course) as a sign of imminent give up on ASL because Etihad would be so much overwhelmed with loss-making Alitalia and AirBerlin, they wouldn not even look at ASL anymore.“ Not true. I said it is not good news for Air Serbia and still thing it is not. I also said that Etihad will be much more concentrating on Alitalia than Air Serbia now, and it is! That is true. But to say they will run out of Air Serbia or that it will immediately give up, that is not true at all. Not even close to my opinion. Plan of 3 routes (JFK, ORD and YYZ ) which is reduced to just JFK is for sure part of that new reality.

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    16. Nikad sve tri destinacije JFK,ORD i YYZ nisu bile planirane nego samo ORD, YYZ ili JFK ,YYZ sto je na kraju izabrano i YYZ nece odma poceti sa letovima nego ce proci nekoliko meseci.
      INN-NS

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    17. Purger,

      1. It is perfectly normal that Etihad will put more focus on Alitalia than on Air Serbia. No one with half a brain would deny it. But it does not necessarily mean that Etihad would CHANGE their plans for Air Serbia because of Alitalia. There is a big difference there. At the time of the ASL deal Etihad was already hunting on Alitalia and their strategy for ASL for sure had taken the Alitalia deal into account.

      2. There was never any official long haul plan for JFK, ORD and YYZ together. Those were mere speculations and I see no base for a claim that it was some ready plan that had to be abandoned because of the Alitalia deal.

      3. Dumping has to stop at some point because each airline wants to turn profitable. But when ASL stops dumping you see it as a clear sign that funds have drained. And what if they simply concluded there was no need to dump further and they can now increase yield on the existing routes and save the dumping funds for some new routes?

      That is the source of the problem here. Even you would not even try to observe ASL's strategy from any positive aspect - whatever happens you simply attribute it to the worst case scenario coming to life. You don't even mention other possibilities - you only recognize the existence of the worst possible option. And if an experienced consultant such as yourself sees things that way then what can we expect from fans and haters?

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    18. 1. Of course they did change their plans. To hunt (tray to make the deal) and to be successful in that is totally different story. When you success for sure you change all your planes not just for Air Serbia, but also for Air Berlin, Aegean, even for Etihad expansion.

      2. Well, lot of announcements by politicians were about those 3 routes. All the time. If we judge just by Kondić announcement, last one was that he is not sure about long-haul flights and that he never make any announcements on that topic (what is not exactly the true). As we all know that those JFK flights are political instructed one in this moment we have to ask why they were reduced. Unfortunately most of discussion here is subject of speculations and predictions, for sure we don't have documents or precise information from Etihad senior managers, but some of the speculations are product of analytics, reading of speculations of important analytics and possibility to understand what happened in air traffic today. For sure you can learn from previous experiences especially Etihad one. „Historia est magistra vitae“.

      3. We agree dumping must stop at some point. But you can never read me saying that stopping dumping is sign of drained funds. I was just asking question that it is not logic that they stop dumping 8 months before starting JFK flights which has to be feeted, and that in combination with big reduction in winter time table one has to ask himself that this policy is strange. I cannot find example of so hard dumping stop (prices went up for 100 and more %) and in same time so big reduction (13%). For that policy you must have some not planed reasons.

      And to say that I am always just with worst scenario is so far away from troth. I am the one who always point all possibilities. So, your comment is not product of my writing or interviews, but will to make me part of ASL hater population what is so not true. Let me just remind you of my last post on this blog:
      I cannot believe what all of you say here. Most of discussion here is political, irrational and have nothing to do with air traffic. You become boring.

      Here are the facts.
      1. It is very good for Serbia to have this licence with or without future flights (and I did not have doubt that JFK flights will be materialised, not even 2 years ago).

      2. It is questionable how those flights to JFK will be financed as there is no chance they will be profitable in near future (and trust me those 2 years planed unprofitability is more than unreal optimistic). (…) November results shows that new strategy of cutting routes and frequencies did not bring enough positive results. And in same time was having bad influence to potential customers and connectivity in BEG. All of those are not good for opening JFK flights. But let's hope that was just permanent measurement for Winter 2015/16 and that in April, enough in advance of opening JFK, that connectivity will come to last year level and it should be even better for support feeding JFK flights. (…)

      huge congratulation to Serbia for this brave move, hope they will finance JFK flights next few years because if they stop now or in few years it will be catastrophic for company. And special congratulations to get licence because we all know what huge job that is and especially in light of MEB3 problems with USA and side problems JU and Serbia had because of that.

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    19. Ovaj Pruger stvarno priča o glupostima kao da je pao sa Marsa. Čitam redovno komentare i on sam više ne zna šta da izmisli i smisli.Ja ti predlažem da malo bolje razmisliš pre nego nešto napišeš ovde pošto se stvarno sramotiš.ASL je pokazala i dokazala da je lider u regiono po mnogo čemu ali naravno nije sve savršeno. Svaki dan napreduju i za to im skidam kapu.

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    20. Lider u kom regionu tacno?

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    21. @6:03 Ex yu recimo... plus koja drzavica okolo..

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    22. Nenade, a gdje ste vi pročitali da ja smatram da ASL nije lider u regiji exYU? Čak štoviše javno sam napao i ismijao CEO CTN-a koji je tvrdio da ASL nije lider u exYU? Brokama sam demantirao njegove smješne stavove da je to i dalje CTN.

      Tvrditi da je ne mislim tako znači ili da niste čitali moje postove i komentare, ili da jeste a onda zlonamjerno izvrčete istinu. Jer to što ste napisali ne samo da nije istina nego je potpuna laž.

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    23. Vise puta si to napisao I to su svi mogli videti.Potpuno se slazem sa Nenadom. Kako mozes tako da demantujes nesto I nekoga nazivas lazovom kada smo mnogo puta videli tvoje negativne komentare I pune nekih kritika. Stvarno bi trebao da pogledas sta si u poslednje vreme pisao.

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    24. To sto je par puta negativno prokomentarisao ne znaci da je hejter ili da omalovazava ceo projekat. Dakle JU cheerleaders oladite malo.

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    25. I read every comment Purger makes on this site, CAF, and others, and to my knowledge he has never made any comment that didn't support ASL as the best and strongest airline in this region.

      He does sometimes criticize ASL but not out of hate or other negative reasons, but out of an interest in civil aviation. Generally his strongest criticism if reserved for Croatia Airlines.

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    26. Hvala Aleksandar i Anonymous 7:51. To i je moj stav. Iskreno izuzetno sam kritičan prema CTN. Smatram da su uništili kompaniju sa nevjerovatnim potencijalima i baš zato hvalim projekt Air Serbije koja je sa daleko manjim potencijalima i negativnim premisama (sve negativnosti koje je sa sobom nosila loša reputacija Jata, dugovi, repovi...) uspjela postaviti ovakav projekt, koji je iskreno i veći od onog što sam se ja osudio predložiti CTN-u. Ja sam se ipak zadržao na exYU i ne bih imao hrabrosti posegnuti u širu regiju.

      No, to ne znači da je sve u ASL-u odmah dobro ili da valja. Upravo suprotno. I baš zbog toga bilo kakvu kritiku treba doživjeti konstruktivno i pozitivno, za dobrobit kompanije. Jednostavno ne razumijem osobe koje to doživljavaju drugačije.

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  5. When will the Americans give permission for these flights?

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    1. Not this year.
      It will be hopefully January or February 2016.

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  6. My question is why haven't they started selling tickets? Even without the FAA certification they can start to sell tickets (with a note that the flights are pending government approval). It is already December and most people have already bought tickets for travel in June and July. The longer Air Serbia keeps off selling tickets the more difficult filling five flights per week next summer will become. People in the US, the diaspora I mean, don't buy tickets this week to travel next week. They buy them months in advance. To me November was the very last month they should have started ticket sales.

    For example Air Transat started selling Toronto-Zagreb flights which start in June back in September.

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    1. People in the US (including me) don't think of summer vacations now. It is not even Christmas yet. Overseas travel tickets are bought 2-3 months in advance.

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    2. I am buying my tickets for USA in May for flight in June. So much you know about buying tickets. Wait someone here from Canada buying expensive tickets one year in advance.

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    3. In Toronto at least, most of agencies we use get really good deals for summer flights approximately in February. However, except retirees, for vast majority this is too early to think about vacation and summer. So the fact that they haven’t started selling tickets I don’t think is catastrophic. However if we get to April let’s say than it definitely will be.

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    4. Ditto. I have never heard of anyone booking summer flights this early as prices come down a bit closer to the travel date.

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    5. Sorry but you guys must be unaware LOT Polish Airlines was selling tickets from New York to Beograd RT for 650 USD last month, NOVEMBER for summer, and I know people personally who have bought these tickets.

      Also, many tour groups (such as Serbian dance groups in the USA / Canada) like purchasing tickets much early, I know one that has already bought tickets for their group, sadly with Alitalia because the offer was good and there are no tickets being sold from Air Serbia.

      Personally, my family got our tickets last year on January 3 and the prices were the cheapest, I checked afterwards too to make sure, in February March etc. So many people have begun booking, and after new years especially people will here in the USA, so I am afraid Air Serbia may miss out on many guests, such as my family and dance group which will be looking to purchase tickets by New Years..

      Who knows, maybe we will be surprised this month with prices / tickets being sold ;) Only hope this doesn't end up like "Air Plus" from Chicago in 2012 where we were sitting at the gate for 3 hours waiting to board which we never could.

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  7. If these flight are going to succeed then JU needs to make ATH double daily, year-round, and to add night flights to IST, SOF, SKG, TIA and OTP. Unfortunately I don't think they will get slots in TLV and the schedule to BEY is kind of tricky. This means that for the time being connecting passengers will be coming from the Balkan peninsula.

    Now, as far as ATH goes, they will be going up against DL's double daily flights, UA's seasonal operations out of EWR and AA will most likely bring back its seasonal PHL route.
    On top of that, there are TK, LH, LX and OS which are all cooperating with A3 (which has its codes on LH's transatlantic flights). I am talking of Greece because it's the second biggest market in the region, the first being IST.
    Without the reinforced regional network this JFK route will fail miserably especially since you can already fly out of BEG for €420 either through LH or via LO. Even Alitalia is dirt cheap with €447.

    If JFK flights are not going to be seasonal then I guess JU will not be able to have major schedule fluctuations as it had this year. One advantage is that in winter ATH doesn't have any direct flights to the US so that's a big opportunity for JU.

    'The service will make travel incredibly more convenient between the United States and the region.'

    Actually, it will make it incredibly more convenient for the Serbian market but not so much for the region. For the region it's yet another option so it doesn't change much for them. Whether you are connecting in BEG or VIE makes little difference, it's still not a direct flight.

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    1. I agree with much of what you said though IST is unlikely to increase. It is subject to the bilateral with Turkey and Turkish would have to be given double daily flights as well.

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    2. Turkish has been flying double daily to BEG for years.

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    3. Actually, when it comes to Turkey JU is in a really good position. The ASA states that airlines from both countries should be allowed to operate the same amount of frequencies. Now, JU is left with two choices:

      1. Push for the rules to be enforced which would mean that both Turkish And Pegasus would have to operate up to 7 weekly flights.

      2. Be smart and up its presence in Turkey. In addition to the afternoon flight, JU could also launch daily night flights AND it wouldn't be such a bad idea to use Pegasus' frequencies to launch 4/5 weekly flights to Ankara.

      Mind you, the ASA also states that TK is not allowed to send anything bigger than a B738 to BEG, A321 included. Given that the B739 and the A321 are regular visitors, one can see how flexible both sides are when it comes to the rules.

      It's funny how the initial slots JU got in IST were so much better than the current ones, in terms of connections.

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    4. Nemjee, do you have a link to the document?

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    5. No, sorry. I don't think you can find the ASAs online.
      However, if you really need it I am sure the Directorate can provide you with a scanned copy. ASAs should be accessible to the public under that law whose name i can't remember now.

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    6. Btw for all interested, Ryanair is adding its fifth aircraft to its Athens base.
      The airline will add seven new routes: Berlin, Bucharest, Dublin, Corfu, Malta, Bologna and Mykonos.

      This will bring the total number of destinations to 19.

      They will also increase ATH-SKG from 6 to 7 daily, Rhodes from daily to double daily and Santorini from two to three daily.
      They expect to carry 3.4 million passengers per year in ATH.

      I wonder if at some point we might see them fly into ex-YU. My guess is that the first route would be ATH-DBV.

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    7. Nemjee,

      OK I will try. So there is in fact a new bilateral between Serbia and Turkey (replacing the SFRJ one from the 50s) where even the type of aircraft is specified? Is this correct?

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    8. JU has seen pretty bad bookings on Belgrade-Istanbul route during last two months, for instance LF in November was as low as 52%. Therefore they cancelled three flights in both December (12th, 16th and 19th) and January (6th, 12th and 19th).

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    9. LX,

      I don't think it's a new one, they just revised the old one from 1953. That's when the a/c restriction was added which does not include cargo and charter flights. I don't recall there being any restrictions for JU so it would be funny if they send their A332 from time to time. :D
      Serbia and Turkey should just sign an open skies agreement and get it over with.

      Anon 13.34

      Thank you for the loads. I am not surprised given the poor connectivity from some places such as Paris, Amsterdam, Brussels... if you go on Air Serbia's website and you try to book a CDG-BEG-IST flight it gives you one of those overnight connections. I highly doubt anyone flies like that given the countless other options between the two cities.
      That's why I said that a night flight to IST is an absolute must. In such a way your entire network could connect onto your IST flight. The flight could depart at 00.30 and return at 05.15.

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    10. Flew IST-BEG a week ago, there were 40 pax on the flight and 90 coming from BEG (for full trip report click on my nickname). The worst being that it was mostly Serbian O&D pax. It was quite shocking that JU couldn't secure more passengers, especially any local ones, from one of the largest metropolises in Europe. At the same time it was interesting to notice that almost no foreign carrier was sending anything bigger than A319/A320 to Istanbul except the Middle Eastern ones such as Saudi Arabian, ME3 and others.

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    11. Turkish directorate will never grant JU a pair of slots (or two pairs) that would allow good connectivity in BEG for transfer flights. They will always protect TK as much as they can.

      Interesting thing is, although Turkish passengers would benefit from more options and would be able to avoid ripoff fares by TK if they could easily transfer via BEG or another hub, you will not find a single media outlet in Turkey that would trash and bash TK for that. And this is not because somebody would ban them from trashing and bashing TK but simply because they do not feel like that. They see the state protection of TK a good thing overall and they would not demand the airline to fail and shut down so that they can have more LCCs and foreign carriers in IST.

      Because even in Turkey not everything is cheap politics. But in Serbia it is.

      Delete
    12. Hmm I don't think the directorate would mind because JU would be requesting middle of the night slots when the airport is rather empty, arrival at around 03.00 and departure at around 05.00. These are the slots that the Turks are more than happy to give to anyone out there.

      Don't forget that Turkish Airlines invest a lot of money in marketing which has become rather aggressive in recent years. If anything, they have created a brand out of TK and the overall flying experience is not bad. Now, the situation at IST is a different story.

      Delete
    13. @AnonymousDecember 14, 2015 at 2:17 PM

      You're perfectly right. If i was on the Turkish side i would act in the exact same way. The thing is people in Serbia have lost their collective consciousness of the society as a whole, Serbia is ridden with individualism and thereby everyone advocates and acts in a way what's seen as its purely personal and short-term benefit what's on the long-term highly detrimental.

      As in what concerns TK, many Turks are aware they're ripping them off (TK is quite hated in Turkey) but they're simply not aware of any other options to fly anywhere outside the Turkish carriers. Turks are very conservative when it comes to travel choices and they don't travel much, especially given the fact that a large percentage even doesn't' speak English thereby they'll either take a direct flight or a Turkish carrier no matter the price. I think it would be a significant boost to the route if Air Serbia advertised in Turkey as a Turkish-speaking carrier by employing a dozen of FA's for that route, that would make a huge difference and the word would spread fast. I mean, if they could replace the Serbian alphabet in the in-flight magazine in order to become more appealing to "regional customers" (half of whom don't understand a word be it in Cyrillic or Latin) then they could make a real and this time intelligent effort for a market of 80 million people. I do not have the exact numbers but it would be interesting to see the BEG-IST LF in both directions, whether the way there offering more connections on one-way tickets offers any better loads.

      PS: The idea about locally speaking FA's could be one of the thing Air Serbia could set itself aside from others carriers in many markets.

      http://www.exyuaviation.com/2015/12/belgrade-decline-continues-into-second.html?showComment=1449568647214#c3513582880087675550

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    14. LH and OS posada ima zastavicu drzave ciji jezik govori posada.

      Delete
    15. Pokretanje Amerike sa postojecom, siromasnom mrezom regionalnih linija i upotrebom problematicnih turbo-prop masina koje putnici vrlo cesto neopravdano izbegavaju je siguran put u bankrot. Nadam se da ce struka koja u ASL nije sporna nadvladati politiku i poredjati poslovne poteze po logicnom redosledu.

      Delete
    16. Ta nas je struka dovela do prodaje i sad dobacuju.

      Delete
  8. The other day I saw in a daily that ASL CEO confirmed these flights would go 1-2-3-4-5 from Belgrade while 6-7 will be operated by partner airlines via Berlin and maybe Rome.

    Can someone elaborate on how smart it is not to fly 6-7 from BEG? Would it be better if they scheduled at least one of those 5 flights over the weekend?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I think that's misinterpretation. They cited "Elevate" as their source and he said no such thing. He said what this article says.

      Delete
  9. Дечко ТзарDecember 14, 2015 at 3:10 PM

    OT: Unlike others, I don't see BEG T1 nor T2 becoming Air Serbia's terminals. New border crossing and check in areas with bag drop at T1 are adding capacity for departing passengers, and that helps when widebody must be dispatched on time. Those new areas and security related enhancements look like minimum investment required for T1/T2, all other investment should go to new Air Serbia Terminal 3, possibly including C concourse extension that could be part of new ASL T3.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. So is the new terminal happening?
      Is there going to be a privatisation or will the state build it with its own money?

      Delete
    2. I don't think the airport will be privatized, remember what happened with Vinci? That would be pretty much the same scenario with anyone else.

      Delete
    3. Government will end payments to Air Serbia by the end of 2016. In 2017 they can start paying for their 51% ownership part of the new Air Serbia terminal.

      Delete
  10. Da se ja pitam nesto ja bi uz buduce JFK letove popravio regionalnu flotu sa ATR 72-500 barem 6 njih i jos sa 8 E-190.
    A sto se tice Evropske flote uz 10 32A sa jos 4 32B.
    A da bi se bilo i malo konkurentno ja bi dodao jos 3 A332 i porucio obavezno jos 6 A359 .
    A moguce linije bi bile uz JFK , ADD, PEK, BKK i naravno YYZ dok ne dodju A359.
    Verovatno ce se mnogo njih smejati ali ko ne rizikuje nista nece ni da ostvari, ali najlakse je reci ne isplati se.
    INN-NS

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No Caracas? Or at least Miami?
      And what about the diaspora in Chicago?

      Delete
    2. Da drzava ima tih nekoliko milijardi koliko bi te ekskurzije kostale, prvenstveno bi resili neke vece probleme u ovoj zemlji od letova za PEK; JFK, BKK... U ovoj zemlji ljudi umiru cekajuci godinama na svoj red za operaciju, a ti bulaznis o kupovini desetina aviona...

      Delete
    3. @6:19 Dete ne lupa više od vas..

      Delete
    4. Aviokompanija moze jako da pomogne razvoju drzave ja ne lupam vi da se razumete znali bi sta pisem.
      INN-NS

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    5. Lupas, ali nema veze.. navikli smo.

      Delete
    6. Vase misljenje je nebititno.
      INN-NS

      Delete
    7. I think that INN-NS has right on this one... you must think big and have better aircrafts to compete the others... but on the other hand, JU could still use their ATR fleet for flights to MBX and other small airports in the region in order to provide them with connectivity with transfer in BEG.

      Hapek

      Delete
    8. It's really unbelievable that anyone of the bloggers keeps on commenting statements by the man signed INN-NS.

      Delete
    9. @10:45.. pogotovo sa ovih 9 sirokotrupaca :))))

      Delete
    10. Da vas ispravim 10 ;)
      Kao sto sam vec rekao najlakse je reci ne isplati se i nista raditi.
      INN-NS

      Delete
    11. 9 širokotrupaca? Ma ne... dodaj još dva pa da ih imaju ko i Austrian!

      Pa gdje bi to letjelo majke ti? I odakle, ili bi još dvije milijarde EUR potrošio na širenje terminala da ti silni širokotupci imaju odakle letjeti?

      Delete
    12. 6+3=10 ma bravo INN. Hvala za ispravku ;)

      Delete
    13. Posto ne znate da citate uz taj jedan A332 da dodju jos 3 .;)
      INN-NS

      Delete
  11. OT: Great pics of new Zagreb airport!

    https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t31.0-8/10710351_10207735328759016_5336279432942454285_o.jpg

    https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xat1/t31.0-8/12119901_10207706426516478_8602073685826237203_o.jpg

    https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtp1/t31.0-8/12079990_10207704311103594_7843946371271343708_o.jpg

    ReplyDelete
  12. OT: Lepo smo rekli 2013 da pocnu Teheran kada su planirali i Bejrut. Sad je malo kasno, svi drugi su skocili da zauzmu pozicije, pa sad ostaju samo mrvice kao sto je charter:

    "Srbiju će u martu 2016. godine posetiti 700 iranskih turista"

    "ako se uspostavi avionska čarter linija između Teherana i Beograda, od juna do septembra u Srbiju dolaziti redovne grupe turista iz Irana. "

    izvor: http://www.blic.rs/Vesti/Drustvo/614032/Srbija-ce-biti-glavna-turisticka-destinacija-turistima-iz-IRANA

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Нека прво почну са потписивањем међудржавног уговора па нек онда причају о било каквом туризму.
      Ако се икада реализују ови летови надам се да ће бити у сарадњи са Маханом. Колико год ми Иран ер био драг, имам осећај да неће још дуго опстати. На крају држава ће морати или да их приватизује или да их угаси.

      Оно што је занимљиво је да је ове године по први пут Иран био присутан на сајму туризма овде у Београду.

      Delete
    2. По други или трећи пут Немјее, грешиш.

      Delete
  13. Which flight numbers will be used for long haul? Do we have any info?

    ReplyDelete
  14. No info just guess: JU001/002 or JU900/901

    ReplyDelete
  15. I have just read on another forum that the the A330-200 will be in Air Serbia livery and start test flights in April 2016.

    ReplyDelete
  16. OT: Hogan's promise from 2013 came through, 9W is moving hub from BRU to AMS and starts big codeshare ops with DL and KL. Short term benefits are clear, however someone who is 'all-in' commited to AB and AZ would place big bet on 9W moving hub to Air Berlin's or AZ FCO hub and then grow connectivity to key markets like UK from there. Priority on getting cozy with SkyTeam overlords seem to trump long term vision of creating singular Etihad Europe (or Global) airline.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. There's much more to it, they're stopping US flights altogether:

      http://www.thehindu.com/business/Industry/jet-airways-makes-amsterdam-its-european-gateway/article7987876.ece

      Delete
    2. Thanks for the news!

      Delete

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