Tuesday, May 5, 2015

Turkey threatens to block Air Serbia charters

Serbian and Turkish protectionism threatens thousands of holidaymakers

The fallout from the Serbian Civil Aviation Directorate’s (CAD) decision to block two Turkish charter airlines from operating to Belgrade this summer is deepening. According to the “Večernje novosti” daily, Turkey, which is due to respond to Air Serbia’s request to carry through with charters this season, has threatened to block the carrier from doing so. The airline’s dedicated charter brand, Aviolet, plans to run flights to Antalya, Dalaman and Bodrum in Turkey this summer on behalf of tour operators. The Serbian CAD has issued a permit to Turkish Airlines to run charter flights from Antalya to Belgrade, while applications made by Corendon and Freebird Airlines have been rejected. The CAD has shifted responsibility onto the Ministry for Construction, Transport and Infrastructure, saying it issues permits to charter carriers based on the advisory opinion of the ministry. An Egyptian charter airline, Nesma, has also been blocked by the Directorate.

Tour operators have begun cancelling holiday packages as issues with charter carriers persist. The two hardest hit operators, Argus Tours and 1A Travel, have accused the ministry of protectionism, adding that Air Serbia and its charter brand Aviolet do not have the necessary capacity to handle the amount of bookings already made. The Assistant Minister, Zoran Ilić, said in a statement yesterday, “We will see what sort of response [Turkish authorities] will give Air Serbia. It is all a matter of reaching an agreement between the regulators and interested carriers from both countries. Until that agreement is reached, not a single foreign carrier will receive permits from us this summer”. The Assistant Minister then admitted it is all a matter of protectionism. Mr. Ilić says that up until now, the Serbian national carrier held an 80% share of all charter flights to Turkey, adding that this commanding stake is now under threat. According to Mr. Ilić, Turkish carriers are creating unfair competition on the market. He insists Air Serbia should be the primary carrier for Serbian holidaymakers. Furthermore, he states that Turkish charter carriers have been trying to pressure the ministry through Serbian tour operators and other diplomatic channels. Mr. Ilić maintains that these carriers were never interested in finding a solution to the issue. The minister herself, Zorana Mihajlović, has stayed silent on the growing problem.

It is not the first time that Serbia and Turkey have been at loggerheads over leisure flights. In 2009, Turkish authorities temporarily revoked Jat Airways’ permit to operate charters to the country after the Serbian CAD blocked Atlasjet from running flights between Antalya and Belgrade. Holidaymakers were rebooked onto scheduled flights to Istanbul and the issue was later settled after a compromise was reached a month later. The Serbian National Association of Travel Agents (YUTA) has called on both sides to settle the issue. “I’m afraid this will put all charters into question. I don’t believe the Turks have a reason to be angry since Turkish Airlines has received permits for a number of flights”, the head of YUTA, Aleksandar Seničić, said. He added, “We just want this to be resolved so holiday makers can get what they paid for”.

164 comments:

  1. Bravo! Big support!


    Neki su pominjali reciproitet... Pa ne moze biti reciprociteta izmedju dve zemlje koje se toliko razlikuju u velicini...


    ić, Turkish carriers are creating unfair competition on the market. He insists Air Serbia should be the primary carrier for Serbian holidaymakers.

    haha pa najveci broj carter saobracaja su srpski turisti koji idu tamo, a ne obratno...

    Znaci ipak je monopol i protekcionizam...

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  2. Admin, could you or anybody else explain to us in which way "Turkish carriers create unfair competition on the market", I really can't take the point.

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  3. Mr. Ilić says that up until now, the Serbian national carrier held an 80% share of all charter flights to Turkey, adding that this commanding stake is now under threat. According to Mr. Ilić, Turkish carriers are creating unfair competition on the market.

    Serbian carrier have 80% of all charter flights to Turkey. That is more than unfair and if I am Turkey authority I would use all methods to make this at least 50:50!

    Protectionism nothing else but protectionism. They destroy Aviogenex to “help” Air Serbia in charter business, now they don’t allowed foreign charter competition to fly even as Air Serbia has 80% cut! More and more companies cut flights and routes to Belgrade because of huge subventions Air Serbia has in Belgrade which makes others not possible to compete. That is protectionism North Korea stile.

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    1. While I do hear you, considering that Serbian tourists and money is leaving the motherland to be spent in Turkey - provide jobs for them and revenues to the Turkish economy, authorities would not necessarily agree with you.

      Landlocked countreis have been known to be tough on transporting their citizens and selling tour packages - its sort of like - here are our nationals as tourists, we will sell them holidays and fly them there, you earn the money of transfers, accomodation, shopping and food...

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    2. Yes, but how much profit did Serbian agencies lose when those flights were canceled?

      First of all it is unsure if Air Serbia would actually manage to deliver all those charters.

      Second, Boeings are crapy.

      Third, JU is probably unsatisfied with the load factor, that's why they chose not to add more routes. They try to consolidate. One of the ways to do so is by taking all the charters for themselves.

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    3. And Serbian agencies who sell those holidays (and have huge cut of income money), Belgrade Airport, NIS petrol company, catering company, support companies, Serbian Air Traffic control… they don't employ Serbian workers and money for them does not stay in country?

      So, by this logic as most passengers on feeding routes to Belgrade (Zagreb, Ljubljana, Sofia, Thessaloniki, Athens, Podgorica, Tivat…) are passengers from those countries it will be fair that 80% of those flights would be operated by Croatia, Adria, Air Bulgaria, Aegean, Montenegro Airlines…

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    4. AnonymousMay 5, 2015 at 9:39 AM

      Are you serious? Or am I misunderstanding you on the issues that your problem is that Serbs go abroad for vacation?

      Delete
  4. Ако има Бога либерализујте више чартер саобраћај и нека саме агенције бирају ко ће превозити њихове муштерије место што им намећу Авиолет кој ће, обрни окрени, летети за Штутгарт, Диселдорф и Беч овог лета.

    Оно што је за мене најодвратније је Ер Србијина похлепа. Хоће по сваку цену да опстану у чартер бизнису а притом немају могућности да изађу у сусрет туристичким агенцијама. Аман, докле више.

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    1. Похлепни су Турци. Хоће све: 2 пута више летова Туркиша до Истанбула од Ер Србије, па још чартере пола и туристе приде!

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    2. Они су хтели те летове до Истанбула зато што су могли да продају сва седишта која су нудили. Зашто би један Туркиш био приморан да ограничи своју понуду у Србији само зато што је ЈУ неспособна да се позиционира на одређеном тржишту?

      Оно што Турци хоће је да све њихове компаније имају приступ српском тржишту. Између осталог, ту би највише профитирале српске туристичке агенције које би добиле знатно ниже цене карата.

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    3. Kada je reč o TK, ako imaju manjak kapaciteta za BEG, potpuno su dobrodošli da pošalju neki widebody.

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    4. Не, највише би профитирали хотели и ризорти у Турској, њихове авио компаније и турска туристичка индустрија. Све турске компаније, и имају директан приступ тржишту у Србији. Коме из Србије је проблем ако мали део тог укупног прихода од туризма иде превознику из Србије, а преко српских туристичких агенција?

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    5. Ne mogu da salju widebody kada u medjudrzavnom sporazumu pise da ne smeju da salju ista vece od B738. Cak je i A321 no no i svaki put kada ga posalju krse dogovor.

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    6. Nemjee, the deal was made in like 50s or 60s so how did they know that B738 will be ever made back then. Correct me if I am wrong, and also where can you even find that deal?

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    7. The previous deal was signed in 1954 this is an agreement that was signed after the IST slot dispute.

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  5. Haha! Just awesome! So the idea of free market, free movement of people and money is something an aspiring EU member has no respect for....it's not for a Assistant Minister to decide who, when and were I go on my vacation. He should just shut the fxck up and let the customers decide on who they go with.

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  6. The stupidity in aviation in Serbia is just reaching new heights day by day....and it's all coming down to the Ministry.

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  7. its a problem that has to be solved and somehow please all parties involved to a certain point.

    On one side you have all these Serbian citizens who are vacationing and spending money in Turkey, Egypt etc. and it's only fair that Serbian aviation profits from this deal.

    On the other hand you have millions of Euros coming into these vacation countries and other then small commission travel agencies make, alongside PDV that the Serb. Government takes, all the rest of the profit goes to those vacation countries.

    Now problem is Turkey wants it's entire pie plus a piece of the Serbian pie in profits. That's not right in my opinion. The other problem is you have Serbia who just CAN NOT take all the lift capacity to these vacation spots. Aviolet can't for sure with their 4 Boeing jets and Air Serbia doesn't have (enough) room to send Airbuses either. If you ask me, I would get more 320 or even 321s and replace ALL 737s with them. That what you have jets ready to be used on either regular or charter routes at all times and crew that can fly any destinations.
    I'm surprised ASL hasn't utilized this market to the fullest, unless they realize there isn't enough money in this charter business for them?

    Just my 2 cents.

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    Replies
    1. I'm stunned. Just another guy who is to decide were I go on my vacation and where I spend my money.....so all tourist are welcome to come and spend their money in Serbia, but you are to regulate were Serbs go and spend their money?! Are you for real?

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    2. Air Serbia 80% share in charter passengers to Serbia!!!!

      Turkish companies pay money to Belgrade Airport, Serbian air traffic control, NIS gas company, Support, catering, Serbian agencies take huge procentage...

      WTF????

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    3. I just read someone complaining about Boings like Turkish charters are all first class cabins. Ridiculous poor men you don't have money for foreign vacation.

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    4. Corendon fly with Boeing 737-800 (average age 12,6 years), and Freebird with A320 and A321 (average age 9,5 years).

      So yes, they are in much better shape.

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    5. With more seats per plain dear Purger. Do not be such asshole.

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    6. Why exactly I am asshole? Am I asshole because those companies have much younger planes that are in better shape? Or I am asshole because I dare to find those data?

      P.S.
      Da vas ne blamiram na engleski da baš svi ne razumiju. Vi stvarno smatrate da je civilizirana komunikacija nekoga nazvati šupkom radi njegova stava, bez da Vas je ičime uvrijedio? Moj rukoljub gospođi majci i molim da joj prenesete da, nažalost, nije obavila baš najbolji posao glede vašeg kućnog odgoja!

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    7. JU has 144 seats in thei B733 so i wouldnt say thats luxury and spacious.

      If Turkish carriers are ready to meet the needs to our travelers I sat bring them on. It is not their fault that our government and our national airline is actively involved in sorting out charter transportation. I think this is more EY influence than anything. I am sure adding a couple A320's and A321's into the EY group fleet could be shifted around as per demand.

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    8. Ja stvarno nemam reci za vas, 180 putnika je nagurano u Freebird A320 koji ima oko 150 putnika u dve klase vs 144 u avion exJAT koji je imao 126 putnika u dve klase.

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    9. O bože pa daj ti onda izračunaj što je gore:

      180 sjedala u avionu koji u standardnoj konfiguraciji prima 165 putnika (AF 180, IB 180, AZ 180, AB 180, JP 180, OU 174, BA 171, LH 168, AF 158, TK 153), što je tek 10% više, odnosno onoliko koliko ima većina kompanija u Europi.

      Istovremeno Air Serbia ima 144 sjedala u 737-300 u kojoj je standardna konfiguraciji ima 130 sjedala (LH 140, PS 135, NZ 133, RO 126, UN 122 –jako je malo kompanija koje uopće još lete sa 733 pa komparacija nije baš tako laka), što je 10% više.

      Naravno, kada sam govorio o tome da su to noviji avioni u daleko boljem stanju mislio sam na stanje unutrašnjosti.

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    10. No you do not want AF or IB as reference to comfort in any case ... and then on top of that you have 10% more... IB has super tight seats.

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    11. To je 5% vise sedista nemoj mi pricati da nemaju heklana miljenca u ASL.

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    12. 180 seats in Freebird is 10% more than 180 seats in Air France. Congratlation!

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  8. But why some agencies prefer choosing foreign airlines to Serbian Aviolet ? Isn't Aviolet subsided just as Air Serbia is ? Do foreigners bribe the owners of tour-operators ? If this is the case, how could they afford to do so ?

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    1. Because Aviolet can't offer them decent times. Last summer a lot of charter flights used to depart Belgrade at around 05.15 in the morning. Why should you force holidaymakers to arrive so early in the morning when foreign airlines can offer nice departures early or late in the afternoon (especially Turkish ones).

      Furthermore, Aviolet is extremely strict when it comes to luggage allowance. One extra kilo is being charged.

      Finally, JU uses Aviolet when one of its Airbuses breaks down. Last year an Antalya flight was delayed for like five hours because they took YU-AND and switched it to LHR.

      That LHR flight was a disaster with 8 business class passengers and no ovens on Delta.

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    2. Which parts of "free will" is it that you don't understand? It's not up to ANY government to decide who I work with as long as I'm within the law. My decision as a tour operator is based on what I get for my money which I'm paying to the airline I wish to work with. This is NOT the governments problem.

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    3. AnonymousMay 5, 2015 at 10:29 AM

      The reason why most charter flights fly early mornings and nights has to do with the airport fees. It's more expensive to arrive and take-off during the day since this is the "business-hours" and this is what the normal airlines pay for, i.e their 'business-passangers". It's about utilizing the airport in the most efficient way, you don't want all flights to arrive in the morning or afternoon, so you give the charter flights discounts to use the hours when there is no business traffic.

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    4. I highly doubt airports such as Antalya, Izmir or Dalaman have many 'business' passengers. During the summer months it's all about Transaero, Thomas Cook and TUI...

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    5. You are right, but there's a destination airport involved as well, plus that during the "daylight"-hours the airplane is utilized for some other flights. It's all about utilizing both the 2 airports involved as well as the airplane and crew.

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    6. Maintenance can be done during day-time, while the business airlines are using their aircrafts, vicevers in the night, charter flies and business is in maintenance .....is not just about flying and selling tickets, it's about costs as well....:)

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    7. Also what is not mentioned is that Avioket doesnt have big enough ac to take on tourists as mentioned in the article. 200 tourists cannot be transported in a B733. JU simply cannot fulfill all demands from all agencies.

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    8. Never heard of two flights? 144+144=288

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    9. Well, certain agencies want their customers arriving at the same time to their destination as it makes their life easier. They approached JU and they realized that they can't meet their demands so they went elsewhere.

      It's JU that needs to work around these agencies, not the other way around.

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    10. since we like maths:

      288-200 = empty seats. 2 ac is 2 x the cost for everything, double landing fees, double fuel, double airport services, double crew etc etc. Also, 2 ac may not always be available.

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  9. Does Turkish DHMI (CAD for airports) really ban ASL to fly more than one daily ? If it is OK to have a balance, somebody must decide about the level of proportion. Maybe if TK wants to fly to Belgrade triple daily they would not care if JU did the same.

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  10. I have to add the fact that Turkish charter carriers transported two thirds of Serbian tourist to Turkish resorts by plane last summer, surely not one fifth. How could deputy minister be informed so bad ?

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  11. RIP, Aviogenex! - Mozda je ipak mogao da posluzi bar jos ovo leto, dvehiljadepetnaesto ?!
    Poznato je da je Jat u sezoni smanjivao svoj redovan saobracaj radi ugovorenih cartera. Treba li da cudi sto je ASL nastavila sa nekadasnjom, dobro oprobanom Jatovom praksom, kao sto kaze Anon 10:29am: "Last year an Antalya flight was delayed for like five hours because they took YU-AND and switched it to LHR. That LHR flight was a disaster with 8 business class passengers and no ovens".

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    1. You can see he wrote pure nonsense.

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    2. Last summer the B733 was common on flights to western Europe, London included.
      I remember even the disastrous YU-AOU flew a few times.

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  12. OT : SMATSA Flight Calibration Services leti oko Niškog aerodroma, rade kalibraciju. Da li se zna kada će biti završeno postavljanje ILS sistema ?

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    1. Next year. And then next year after that.

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    2. I'm pretty sure it should happen this year. I just asked if someone knew exactly when ... Wizz Air requested ILS in order to operate from INI, which is logical thing, especially if visibility is bad.

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  13. Svaki Turista koji leti preko Austriske Agencije leti sa HG ili OS, a sve i jedan Engleski charter ide preko Engleske Turisticke Agencije i to obavljaju BY,ZB.MT i BA tako da nista cudno nije samo se nase Agencije bune zato sto ne mogu vise da prime ekstra pare od stranih prevoznika da izaberu njih .
    Slazem se sa my 2 cents da bi bilo odlicno da ASL nabavi 2 A320 ceo i 2 A321 ceo za charter ali i regularan saobracaj.
    INN-NS

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    1. Wrong. just bought a vacation through ruefa vienna and flying with aegean. INN - SNS fail yet again. Jees can you ever say something balanced and true? if you insist in being the oracle that only says great zero-sum truths you will always fail inn sns. pamet u glavu, ne budite lenji.

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    2. Napiši mu to na srpskom, vidiš da te ne razume..

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    3. Ja pricam o INN posto imam listu sa Aerodroma koje Agencije su iznajmile koju Aviokompaniju.
      Ja imam srpsku 5 iz Engleskog samo sto necu da ga koristim na ovom blogu
      INN-NS

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    4. Napisite onda "svaki turista koji ide iz Innsbruka" a ne "Svaki Turista koji leti preko Austriske Agencije". Slazete se da je velika razlika? Ne mozete lazima ovde da prodjete.

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    5. I opet pričaš nonsense INN. Turske charter kompanije letjele su u prošloj godini:

      AtlasGlobal, 17 aviona, charter kompanija
      Corendon, 10 aviona, charter kompanija
      Freebird, 10 aviona, charter kompanija
      Onurair, 23 aviona, dobar dio charter letovi
      Saga, do 4 aviona po sezoni, charter kompanija
      SunExpress, 74 aviona, veći dio flote leti charter letove, manji dio redovne linije koji su u stvari redovni charter letovi uz mogućnost kupnje karata preko interneta (50% vlasništvo LH, 50% TK)
      Tailwind, 7 aviona, charter kompanija
      Turkish Airlines, obavlja i charter letove

      Ove kompanije obave više od 20.000 charter letova svake godine na nekoliko stotina destinacija. Stoga molim te nemoj iznositi neprovjerene podatke.

      I ti nisi spominjao samo INN, nego austrijske i engleske agencije. Ali čak i ovo sa INN nije točno jer iz INN redovne chartere za Tursku (svi za Antalyu) lete Niki (jednom tjedno), Austrian (dva puta tjedno) i SunExpress (dva puta tjedno) od kojih je posljednja turska kompanija i dakle leti 40% letova, a prema kapacitetima aviona 50% putnika.

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    6. Nisu to lazi u 80 % slucajeva je tako a vi verovatno imate Agenciju pa necete ove godine dobiti ekstra para da bi vasi turisti leteli sa turcima .
      Purger
      Mislio sam na letove do Austrije ne turske destinacije.
      Ja sam za INN rekao Austriske Turisticke Agencije salju vecinom preko OS I HG a sa XQ ima ugovor Gület reisen koji ima licencu od TUI-a a to turci drze u Innsbrucku.
      Valjda znam procitati sa liste Agencije.
      INN-NS

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    7. Naravno da nemam licnih interesa - kao sto sam napisao - kupio sam odmor iz beca i letim aegean-om.
      Prvo laz pa onda pokusaj diskvalifikacije sagovornika pa onda nova laz o tome sta ste prvo rekli je oproban recept ;) Srecom svako moze da procita tvoj inicijalni post i da se uveri koliko si 'zaboravan'......

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    8. Nisi ti ništa mislio nego si po običaju izlupetao prvu budalaštinu koja ti je pala na pamet pa sada menjaš to nakon što su te ljudi pokopali konkretnim podacima i argumentima.

      Uz to bez ikakvih dokaza optužuješ druge posetioce bloga da primaju mito tj. pravna lica iz druge zemlje da daju mito. Ne znam da li ti je jasno da ih sve javno optužuješ da čine ozbiljno krivično delo. Za takvo ponašanje bio bi naglavačke najuren sa svakog foruma pre nego što stvar izmakne kontroli i neko pravnim putem zatraži da izneseš dokaze za svoje tvrdnje. Imaš sreću pa je ovo blogspot platforma i admin nema previše mogućnosti da te tretira onako kako zaslužuješ.

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    9. Nisam se najbolje izrazio u prvom postu to je istina ali nek me tuze slobondo @ 3:06 .
      Ja znam vecina prijatelja sto idu preko Austriske Agencije lete sa HG ili OS a to za dikvalifikaciju meni svaki dan rade pa se ne bunim , izvinite ako vas je uvredilo
      A ovo sto sam rekao za INN je istina nismo se najbolje sporazumeli . Ja znam da vecini to smeta i jedva cekaju lose vesti o ASL.
      INN-NS

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    10. Dobro sinko, hajde da ti nacrtam, letovi za Antaliu iz Innsbrucka:

      OS2249/50 A320 subotom, 9.5-24.10., Austrian za Gulet, TUI i 1-2-FLY
      OS 2243/44 A319 nedjeljom, 27.9-18.10. Austrian za Gulet, TUI i 1-2-Fly

      XQ6296/97, 738, subotom od 25.4. do 24.10., turski SunExpress za Gulet, TUI i 1-2-FLY
      XQ 6224/25, 738, nedjeljom 17.5-27.9, turski SunExpress za Gulet, TUI i 1-2FLY.

      Niki je planirao letjeti za Antalyu ali je ipak odustao.

      Dakle većinu toga leti SkyExpress dok Austrian leti tek jedn let tjedno i drugi let tek sa tri rotacije u 10. mjesecu.

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    11. Pa sta je Gület nego turska agencija i zato vecinu letova obavlja Turska Aviokompanija na to sam mislio mozda niste razumeli na sta mislite.
      INN-NS

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    12. So people of Innsbruck have only 1 agency ( Turkish in this case) which sells tickets to Turkey and arranges direct flights?

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    13. Hahahhhahahahahaahahahahahah INN-NS, please, stick to one theory. Your arguments are changing as often as the value of the Serbian Dinar.

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    14. Da sve 3 Agencije drze turci a za ostale agencije su Austriske firme malo jeste glupo =D
      INN-NS

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    15. Citiram te INN "Svaki Turista koji leti preko Austriske Agencije leti sa HG ili OS, a sve i jedan Engleski charter ide preko Engleske Turisticke Agencije i to obavljaju BY,ZB.MT i BA"

      Obzirom da TUI i 1-2-FLY, ali i Gulet koji je kompanija u vlasništvu TUI-a (a ne turska), većinom lete sa turskom kompanijom iz INN iznio si neistinu. Ne prvi puta na ovom cijenjenom fotumu. Ili mi želiš reći da je možda i TUI turska kompanija pošto lete SunExpressom?

      samo usput kad si ih već spomenuo u istom kontekstu i većina engleskih tusitičkih kompanija za tursku leti jeftinijim tuskim charter kompanijama.

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    16. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    17. GÜLET drze Turci ali vi znate sta ko drzi u INN nema veze kraj price.
      INN-NS

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    18. Ma jasno INN nije bitno tko je vlasnik kompanija nego tko je "drži" što god to značilo.

      No, da zanemarimo Gulet, jasno si rekao da većina Austrijanaca iz INN za Tursku putuje neturskim kompanijama. Naravno to nije istina. TUI nije turska kompanija, većina njihovih putnika leti sa turskom SunExpress.

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    19. Please INN-NS I am working for TUI Austria hence I can ensure you that you are 100% wrong. Gulet is entirely an Austrian travel brand and TO and to 100% owned by TUI Austria with travel packages and catalogues actually being produced by TUI Germany in Hanover.

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    20. 8:24 anon, then what is up with the turkish name? Please dont tell me that Gulet is not a Turkish name.

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    21. Purger
      Sad se razumemo :)
      Naravno da GÜLET drzi turcin ali saradjuje sa TUI-em.

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    22. Slucaj Cicko, Gulet je 100% u vlasništvu TUI grupe!

      I odlično što si razumio Purgera, konačno si prizno da lupaš u prazno i da nemaš pojma. Jer čovijek ti je argumentirano objasnio da si lagao jer večina austrijanaca koji putuju preko austrijskih agencija putuje sa turskim kompanijama, dok si ti tvrdio suprotno.

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    23. Ako sam ja Macak onda ste vi misevi.
      Za tursku je tako zato sto Gület drzi turcin ima licencu TUI-a
      INN-NS

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    24. This is the first time where I think INN-NS is right, simply because Gulet is pure Turkish name. It is owned by a TURK who works with TUI/close cooperation.

      Delete
    25. Gulet is part of TUI, end of discussion. It's not a Turkish company.

      GULET ist Teil der TUI – des erfolgreichsten Touristikunternehmens der Welt.

      http://www.gulet.at/ueber-uns/gulet_infos

      Tako da INN-SNS-Cicko-Macor lupa po starom dobrom obicaju.

      Delete
    26. First of all it is "Gulet" not "Gület" and yes Gulet is also a name for a turkish sailing boat but that has nothing to do with the Austrian Tour Operator from TUI.

      Delete
  14. It's already 5th, and not many airports are posting april numbers. I am interested in SKP numbers most, then if BEG continues great growth (>10 %)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. BEG growth is just 3% in April

      Delete
    2. BEG growth +4%

      Small correction (that doesnt change the substance)

      Delete
    3. That 4% growth is really concerning. Numerous charters blocked plus no new carriers in BEG could potentially see decrease in the number of passengers. I hope I am wrong, but 2 weeks ago I said that April figures will be low ( less than 5%) and a couple of members on here "attacked" me for stating facts.

      Delete
    4. Well, two weeks ago any predicted figures for April were not facts. Simply, it turned out that you'd been right. Maybe.... Let's wait for official figures.

      Delete
    5. It's official. It's on their website.

      Delete
    6. 4% growth is concerning for those who don't pay attention. Last April was annomaly, if it had been slightly less explosive, this April would look like 10% growth over last year. If you compare April 2015 with 2013, growth is about 50%, which is stunning. Things will even out with May numbers. No need to panic!

      Delete
    7. It can be facts if you look at the number of flights and the types of aircraft that usually serve BEG. Figuring stats is quite a simple process actually, and technically speaking we do not need official stats. I predicted 3% with my calculations and I guess I was wrong for 1% lol.

      Delete
    8. JAT had major problems in April 2013 which caused a drop in pax of almost 6% comapred to year prior. When comparing increase April 2012 to April 2015 the total increase is around 43% which comes to around 15% per year. Last year the growth in April was 46% YOY, while it is now only 43% compared to 2012. Therefore, yes - there is growth, but not as impressive as it seems.

      Delete
  15. I suppose some comments today have been posted by travel agents. Perhaps they can give us some benchmark, for example, how many British or German tourists are flown to Turkish resorts by Turkish charters and how many are flown by British/German charters? And how is this regulated (if it is regulated)?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. 72% by SunExpress and other turkish charter carriers.

      Delete
  16. Mr. Exyu Editor, please correct your statement that Serbian national carrier held an 80% share of all charter flights to Turkey. That number is not correct. Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Please note that this is a statement from the minister, not this website.

      Delete
    2. It appears as if Exyu is okay with his statement. Some other news sources would allow quote from the minister, as well as other sources that may paint a different picture. By all accounts Turkey had majority of charter marketshare. For example, you can reach out to Aviolet to confirm if they have 80% of the share.

      Delete
    3. Maybe it is OK that British tourist are transported by British carriers and German tourists by German carriers, but the problem could arise when in a country only one carrier exists which could then blackmail agencies. Is there any published official price-list of Aviolet's Boeing renting. If a carrier is one and only, the price of one block-hour could be anything.

      Delete
  17. Mnogo poturica danas.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Or simply libertarians?

      Delete
    2. Ne lupaj gluposti i u USA drzava i te kako kontrolise avio trziste.

      Delete
    3. Ne lupaj ti, ovako me kontrolise.

      Delete
    4. To je delimicno tacno. Svako se bori za svoj interes. Ali ovde je dodatan problem da li AS (Aviolet) ima kapacitet da odgovori potraznji? Slazemo se valjda AS nije jedini interes drzave i da postoje i agencije a najvaznije postoje i TURISTI (gradjani) koji su platili putovanje i koji ne smeju biti osteceni radi interesa drzavne kompanije (koja izmdju ostalog mozda i nije u stanju da iskoristi jacu monopolsku poziciju nego sto je imala do sada)?

      Delete
    5. Fuel Cost Per Hour: $4547.7 ne znam dali je toliko i kod ASL.
      INN-NS

      Delete
    6. An 2:55 Pogledaj proslogodisnje postove u ovo vreme. Turci imaju primat i u charterima.

      Delete
    7. @Anon 2:55

      Tačno je da su turističke agencije u interesu države, ali su pare koje turističke agencije zarade od prodaje turskih karata manje od para koje bi zaradio Aviolet plus pare koje bi turističke agencije zaradile od prodaje Aviolet karata. Sve zajedno, za državu je jasno gde je veći interes.

      Pre par dana je ovde bio komentar kako je Kanada zaštitila domaćeg prevoznika na štetu Emirates-a jer im je dozvolila samo 3 leta nedeljno za čitavu zemlju. Turističke agencije iz Kanade bi naravno jedva dočekale da se dozvoli Emirates-u da leti dva puta dnevno do 5-6 najvećih gradova, ali vlada je naravno gledala da li su važniji interesi agencija koje bi preplavile tržište jeftinim kartama Emiratsa preko Dubajia do recimo Indije, ili je važnije da Er Kanada profitabilno leti do Indije i ostalih zemalja. Nauk za turističke agencije iz Srbije.

      Delete
  18. http://www.eurocontrol.int/news/free-route-airspace-sarajevo-zagreb-belgrade
    Lepe vesti :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If I got it right, airplanes will not have to enter or exit the state at a certain point?

      Delete
  19. http://akter.co.rs/26-ekonomija/126578-ju-kod-letovima-na-liniji-peking-be.html
    Lepa vest, takodje. Nego sta ono bese sa A330 za Kinu?!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. INN-NS you were talking about direct flights from BEG, stop denying what you said.

      Delete
    2. Rekao sam istina idu na sim i ETOPS uskoro za A330 .
      INN-NS

      Delete
    3. INN-NS if what you are saying is true, why are you the only member saying it. There are plenty of other members here who even work in ASL or aviation business and yet have clearly said they do not know anything. Who ever is giving you info is clearly fu**ing with you.

      Delete
    4. @ 4:07 PM
      Nije da im verujete mogu i ja reci radim za vladu a ne radim. Nisam im ja kriv sto nikoga ne poznaju iz vraha ja znam i obicne zaposlene u JU.
      Njima se smeju ljudi iz Ju koje gluposti ovde pisu. A govore kako ja lupam gluposti zato sto ne mogu da pisu gluposti o JU .
      A idu na sim to budite sigurni uskoro.
      INN-NS

      Delete
    5. Pa dobro i svi se tebi smeju ovde pa nikom nista.

      Delete
    6. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    7. A to sto mi se smeju ljudi ovde to me ne zanima ni malo niti me se tice zato sto niste bitni ni malo osim pojedinaca. I sto skrecete sa teme idu na sim za A330
      INN-NS

      Delete
    8. dobro ljudi stvarno zar se moramo spuštati na ovu razninu komunikacije. mislim da nas vecina ovdje ima više od 15 godina i stvarno nam ne treba da razgovaramo kao pubertetlije tipa "tko vam je kriv što ne poznajete više ljudi", "moj striko je bolji od tvog", "ja nisam tako mislio nego ovako, ali i ovako nego zapravo ovako..." ignorirajte balavca pa ce otici od tuda

      Delete
    9. Цицко, the dangerous mačor, is on a roll y'all.

      Delete
    10. Ja nisam nikome nista rekao danas oni su poceli sa provokacijama, a to na kom sam ja nivou necemo sad raspravljati
      Idu na sim za A330 uskoro

      Delete
    11. Jel to za onaj 332 sto dolazi proslog meseca?

      Delete
    12. Bas ce biti dobra ova i sledeca godina dolazak ATR-a uvodjenje wi-fi celu Airbus flotu i moguc dolazak jos kojeg Airbus-a i slanje pilota na sim za A330 .
      INN-NS

      Delete
    13. Кад Te човек ништа и не пита, Tи опет...понављаш то, ко Шваба тралала.

      Delete
    14. INN-SNS-A330 Radical Fail

      Delete
    15. INI-SNS CICKO FAIL

      Delete
  20. I guess it would be the best for Serbian tour operators to fly Serbian tourist from Tuzla or even Sarajevo since Turkish, Corendon, Freebird and Atlasjet fly here as much as they want, no national carrier in B&H= no problem, its open market.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Turkey and Serbia fail

    ReplyDelete
  22. http://www.crnojaje.hr/Deals/Details/5838

    ReplyDelete
  23. OT: A319 YU-APJ is finally back in action for the first time in more than three weeks. It takes less time to complete C check!

    If wifi sat equipment is installed, does anyone have a picture of the "bump"? Plane is taking off for DUS right now. I don't think wifi is going to be offered on this flight, but hope to hear from people on board!

    ReplyDelete
  24. And lift off, YU-APJ back in service, with WIFI installed.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I šta sad svi vi koji ste ovih dana pisali teorije o APJ kao početak propasti ASL, nije li vas malo blam?

      Delete
    2. Blam je JAT Tehniku jer im je trebalo tri nedelje za wifi.

      Delete
  25. Bravo for -APJ, bravo for ASL !

    ReplyDelete
  26. OT: in mid may new ATR75 joins the fleet, YU-ALV

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. New regional destionations and frequencies. Probably Pristina, more Adriatic frequences, perhaps Brac?

      Delete
    2. Nope, replacement of the Boeing to TGD, LJU + ZAG.

      Delete
    3. yep, and boing goes on charter flights

      Delete
    4. sweet, so liberated 737 can also operate charters during daytime as sensitive tourist agencies requested.

      Delete
    5. The issue is not the time but capacity and frequency.

      Delete
    6. won't be issue if Turkey rejects ASL.

      Delete
    7. A ko sad laze i lupa gluposti do kraja godine ce doci jos koji .
      Nema zasad novih destinacija samo pojacavanje frekvencija.

      Delete
    8. Ne smaraj.

      Delete
  27. OT : As per Skyliner Aviation - ATR 42 that was operating for Air Croatia got "ferried 23/27apr15 ZAG-RTM-ABZ, Air Croatia titl removed at RTM, ops now ABZ-based for Denim Air"

    ReplyDelete
  28. The miserable growth of Belgrade Airport in April is just the beginning. Since many foreign airlines are leaving BEG, charters are blocked and ASL unable to accelarate their business model, I expect even zero or negative figures. Typical protectionism that ends up in circus and then crash!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I am surprised nobody is commenting on this. When the growth was 20%+ there were like 50 comments about it.

      Delete
    2. To add to my comment 9:04, this figures su "ucutale bubice" in INN-NS and the rest of the ASL fan boys

      Delete
    3. Jedna lasta ne čini proleće.

      Delete
    4. @Anon 8:49

      Your doomsday predictions for BEG are not based on facts. If you take 2014 BEG passenger numbers for Feb - Jun and do numerical interpolation on those data points, you will clearly see that actual 2014 April numbers stand out while 2014 May numbers lag in terms of growth, compared to interpolated values. What that means: last April had unusually high number of passengers while May was slower.

      When you compare April 2015 data point with that interpolated value instead of actual April 2014 figure, you will see that growth for 2015 is actually "on track". As a homework, you should find out exactly how much.

      Delete
    5. H8ters don't know math, let me help them: April 2015 has 11.6% growth compared to 2014 Feb-Jun interpolated line.

      Delete
  29. ni vi navijaci ni protivnici air Serbie se ne razumete u avijaciju ni malo. Veze vi nemate, ni jedni ni drugi, samo bespotrebno zagadjujete blog svojim navijackim i politikantskim komentarima.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Vazno da postoje moralno superiorni ljudi poput tebe. Zhiw bio.

      Delete
    2. Elem rast je sasvim solidan ako se ima u vidu da je W6 zatvorio gomilu ruta u Aprilu, da je smanjen i odredjen boj letova clanica Star alijanse i da ekspanzija Air Serbije nije bila toliko velika. Najznacajniji kriterijum je i dalje pozitivan - to je kriterijum rasta putnika u odnosu na broj avio operacija. Avio operacije su porasle svega 1% i mislim da je tome najvise doprineo cargo, pa i generalna avijacija. Mislim da je broj redovnih linijskih aviooperacija na putnickim letovima cak i opao. Ovo znaci da je load factor bolji,. Koliko je interesovanje putnika ove godine najbolje govori to sto sve cesce vidjamo A321, od AZ, LH, LX pa i TK. Broj stranih turista u Srbiji raste kao i broj ljudi koji presedaju u BEG. Broj domacih O&D putnika je verovatno opao zbog recesije, a u Maju cemo opet imati nesto veci rast jer su poplave prosle godine taj rast usporile. Carter problemi ce biti reseni ove ili sledece nedelje, nece biti nikakve stete, letece i Turci u istom obimu kao i prosle godine, ovo su neke politicke i ko zna kakve igre ali to sto nasi rade ne smeju da urade, postoji mogucnost ostrih sankcija nego se sad kurobecaju da bi dobili malo vise od Turaka.
      Naravno ima tu i protekcionizma Air Serbie jer se moraju isplatiti silne plate zaposlenima preko SNS. U kompaniji je bar 1000 ljudi visak, to je nepotreban trosak od 20 miliona EUR na godisnjem nivou. Protiv tog zla se treba institucionalno boriti a ne protiv Air Serbie kao kompanije.

      Delete
    3. @9.22 sve se slazem.. ali de ga nadje 1.000 plata za SNS, majke ti?! ASL ima isto zaposlenih kao i ranije.

      Delete
    4. JU ima 18 aviona a 2500 zaposlenih, skoro 140 po vazduhoplovu...

      Delete
    5. @10.38 bas si me nasmejao ;) a istine radi: Air Serbia 1.234 zaposlena
      Air Serbia ketering 125 zaposlenih
      Air Serbia ground services 249 zaposlenih

      Delete
    6. Gde ste nasli 1000 ljudi jesam i ja medju njima .
      INN-NS

      Delete
    7. Istine radi?! 1608 po Vama ili "preko 1900" po Air Serbia sajtu, gde Vam se zagubilo 300-350 zaposlenih?
      "Air Serbia trenutno ima preko 1.900 zaposlenih, uključujući i zavisna preduzeća Air Serbia Catering i Air Serbia Ground Services". Izvor:http://www.airserbia.com/sr-be/novosti/air-serbia-ostvarila-profitabilnost-u-prvoj-punoj-godini-poslovanja

      Delete
    8. Sve ce to da legne na svoje. Secam se price oko toga da ASL nikada nece se moci vratiti na IST. Secam se price da ce za ZAG moci samo point-to-point putnici i da on tranzita nece biti nista. Secam se price da ce se wizz povuci iz BEG pa nije. Ima ovde prostora i za TK i JU a to sto Argus Turs spinuje sa pricom oko dozvola....ma i to ce se resiti. Ajd uzdravlje.

      Delete
    9. JU ima 19 aviona, za par nedelja imace 20. 1234/20 = 61,7 ljudi po avionu.

      Delete
    10. @Anon at 11:12

      Argus Tours treba da se preseli u Kanadu i da proba da lobira da se Emirates-u dozvoli 20-30 letova nedeljno, da vidim kako ce proci!

      Delete
    11. 1900/19 = 100 radnika po avionu.

      1900 i 19 su informacije sa sajta Air Serbije.

      Delete
    12. Ocigledno neki ovde bolje znaju nego zvanicni sajt i to "istine radi" kao npr.@Anon at 10:54p.m.

      Delete
    13. Ok, to i dalje nije 2.500 kao sto rece 10.38

      Delete
  30. Aviogenex bird was sold to a company in Benin.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Senicic zamenjuje teze -- gradjani su platili mutljave aranzmane sa letovima za koje nisu ni postojale dozvole, a te aranzmane su im prodale (u saradnji sa kojekakvim turskim sibicarima) agencije koje g. Senicic predstavlja. To je takodje deo ove price.

    ReplyDelete
  32. Serbian carriers may have right to dominate the charter flights from Serbia but what will happen if Turkey ban all charters? Actually 77-million country will not lose a lot if charter flights stop. I think Serbian side has to be more logical and careful. (Cheers from Turkey)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The questio you have ti ask yourself is what Turkish Gov.values more: aviation or tourism? Cutting off charter flights would mean more expensive travel meaning less tourists in Antalia and Bodrum. I have a slight feeling that ASL has an upper hand here for this reason alone, but I might be wrong.

      Delete

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