Adria plans to open Paderborn base


Adria Airways is negotiating the opening of a base in Paderborn in north-western Germany, an airport spokeswoman has confirmed. The Slovenian carrier plans to introduce flights from the city to London Southend, Vienna and Zurich. Although the exact frequencies are yet to be defined, services to Switzerland's largest city are tipped to run eleven times per week, while flights to London and Vienna will operate three times per week. Paderborn Airport has said that talks with Adria should be completed in the coming days when more information will be made public. The base is expected to open at the start of the 2018 summer season, in late March.

Adria Airways is tipped to station a Saab 2000 aircraft in Paderborn if talks prove successful. The carrier will take up to six of the fifty-seat turboprops from its former, now defunct, subsidiary Darwin Airline. Some of the aircraft will be based in Ljubljana and perform services to Sofia, Bucharest, Hamburg, Geneva, Dusseldorf, Dubrovnik, Brač, as well as a select number of flights to several other cities in the region. However, this will still leave Adria with a surplus of Saabs. The airline has previously indicated the turboprops could be wet-leased in line with its developing ACMI (aircraft, crew, maintenance, insurance) operations.

Outside of Ljubljana, Adria boasts a base in Pristina from which it handled 177.166 passengers in 2017. Last year, the carrier closed down its base in Lodz in Poland. Over the past few years it has also considered stationing an aircraft in Klagenfurt in Austria, as well as Verona, Bratislava and Bern. Paderborn Airport has a limited number of flights with Lufthansa serving the city from Frankfurt and Munich on a year-round basis. All other services are maintained seasonally during the summer, primarily to holiday hotspots in Turkey and Greece. The airport handles just over 700.000 passengers per year. Paderborn is located in the state of North Rhine-Westphalia, which is Germany's most populous.

Comments

  1. It is now becoming clear, that the airline is a marionette of Lufthansa, playing by its flute.

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    Replies
    1. Adria was always a marionette of LH but as a Star Alliance member, has nothing to do with ownersip. Sad enough, the most dance like LH plays. Those who don't ends like AB did.

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    2. ????

      Actually it's the very opposite. LH wants the passengers to transfer via their hubs at FRA and MUC!

      Why on earth would they want a foreign airline in which they don't even have a minority stake to fly people P2P in Europe bypassing there hubs. Furthermore it is competition to them, you will see how PAD-FRA-ZRH for example will become cheaper with LH if JP starts flying. LH will effectively earn less on these routes.

      I don't think I ever heard conspiracy theories more weird than in the comment section here.

      In contrast to LX and OS you do realize that JP and OU are in no means part of LH Group. Just the alliance is the same and they have some code shares. That's it.

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    3. Well it is better to have JP in PAD than lets say EasyJet or Ryanair. And ZRH or VIE, the two destinations served, will cetrainly feed LX and OS - so the LH group. SEN is just a byproduct and serves the large UK military bases that are in the region.

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    4. Alen Šćuric Purger8 February 2018 at 10:18

      Ohhhh, so not true.

      For LH, who is 100% owner of Swiss, Austrian and Brussels, it is absolutely the same if you fly via FRA, MUC, or VIE, ZRH and BRU. So many times I bought ticket by Lufthansa and had possibility to fly via FRA and MUC, but instead it was better (cheaper, faster) to fly vie VIE, ZRH, BRU on one way or even there and back without touching MUC or FRA.

      So, to make connection to ZRH and VIE is important strategy for Lufthansa the same way as to MUC and FRA. Absolutely the same.

      But in same time you kill competition on that way. If you have more flights to your hubs (FRA, MUC, ZRH, VIE, BRU) than you will kill possible competition (to fly to AMS, CDG, LHR, MAD, PRG...). Also there is less chance for LCC to come to those small airports (and there is so many examples where LCC open bases in even much smaller airports and kill legacy carrier there).

      In that light London Southend is preventive measure. It is not Heathrow or Gatwick where potential passengers could transfer instead of FRA, MUC, VIE, ZRH, but it is P2P route to kill potential LCC (we all know that LCC first open London especially easyJet, Ryanari, Wizz and even Norwegian).

      And last but not least, one has to understand that British try to hit Lufthansa by buying NIKI for Vueling. And LH react urgently (by Niki Lauda as long year partner of Lufthansa). For sure opening London from Paderborn is preventive measure against evident British penetration into LH backyard.

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    5. JP is not owned or controlled in any way by LH group.

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    6. ^ Not officially but in practice...

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    7. Oh gosh.

      OS for example usually doesn't implement codeshares easily with foreign / non-LH-Group airlines. You will see there won't even be a codeshare between PAD-VIE (JP).

      The only thing that is true is that passengers might benefit by being able to conncet at ZRH/VIE to other star alliance member airlines, but why would LH-Group want that? Economically it makes no sense.

      If someone wants to go from PAD to BEG for example, LH wants passengers to fly the whole journey with LH-Group-Airlines so that all income remains within the Group.
      When a pax flies PAD-VIE (JP) and VIE-BEG (OS), then only the income that is OS' part (VIE-BEG) will remain with LH-Group.

      It would be much better for LH if people continue flying (at high fares) PAD-MUC-BEG or PAD-FRA-BEG all with LH where the whole fare remains with LH.

      And besides, why would the Oh-so-LH-controlled JP fly to SEN, wouldn't it make much more sense to fly instead to STR, a large EW base, to feed again a 100% LH-Group-airline? By the way, the route PAD-LON has not worked out in the past several times already, even Cityjet with a F50 had to cancel it. Seems like the British soldiers did not really use the route, at least not even enough to make it viable with a F50, together with very low demand of regular private and business travelers. Also AB used to fly PAD-LON and cancelled it again.

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    8. There is a huge difference between working for Lufthansa, and working in a way that does not hurt Lufthansa.

      And actually, it is not only Adria that is trying that strategy. It is the very strategy that BMI Regional is executing for few years. And as everybody sees, both BMI Regional and LH are extremely happy about that. However, Lufthansa would not be too happy if BMI Regional would grow say 5 fold in that way. They rather prefer to have some independent BMI Regional clones that compete to some degree.

      Of course, there is some reservation at the moment from LH towards Adria. But if they finally fly on a regular basis, they Adria will get an LX code on the ZRH connection.

      I do not what problem "Purger" has with LH, but dreaming up any partnership between LH and Lauda at the moment is as hilarious as a characterization of a London connection by Adria as an preemptive measure against Easyjet or Ryanair. (For a start: Who is to "blame" that Lauda did not recruit any crew nor got any planes yet? Ryanair and Easyjet already fly from London to Dortmund which is a short 35min from PAD. Obviously, Adria is hoping for a very different segment of the market.)

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    9. @anon 12:13: I guess that no one at LH is loosing her sleep to worry about PAD-BEG (If they will have more planes at EW, they will try one day DTM-BEG and cancel it again ;-( )

      And there is a reason that there will be no more PAD-FRA flights after march.

      Anybody who is very price sensitive in the PAD area has plenty of option nearby. And this is the very reason that Adria will try some business destinations from PAD, as it should be much easier to sell few premium seats twice a day to ZRH than to fill an a319 twice a week.

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    10. Alen Šćuric Purger8 February 2018 at 16:01

      "Austrian usually don't implement code share..."
      You really wrote this?

      Austrian-Croatia code share on OU flights from Zagreb, Split, Dubrovnik, on some 25 flight per week.

      Austrian-Adria code share on all Adria flights to Ljubljana, Austrian does not have flights on it's own.

      Austrian-Montenegro, Austrian has code-share with Montenegro even that Adria, Lufthansa and Swiss does not have such a deal.

      Austrian also has code-share on 32 different companies including Air Baltic, Air France, Air Malta, Belavia, Georgian, Luxair, TAROM, Ukraine international...

      So can't be more wrong.

      I explain why they did start with London route. And trust me, Adria would never penetrate into Lufthansa backyard without blessing and instruction of mighty Lufthansa. Etihad was destroyed because of it and Adria would work on it's own? Come on!

      Hilarious, OK we will see. It was hilarious when I predict that LH will destroy Air Berlin (not collaborate with it), that I predict that LH will fly from every village in Croatia (and that was publicly predicted by me when they fly just and only from Zagreb), that I predict Eurowings will have expansion in Croatia (and today Croatia is their 2nd the biggest market), that I predict Swiss (for Lufthansa) main goal to destroy Darwin, that I predict destiny of Etihad because of Lufthansa countermeasures... I don't have problem with Lufthansa but I can see their pattern as I follow and analyze their business last 30 years intensively.

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    11. Purger there is no cordination between jp and lh; please stop with this nonsense.

      Delete
    12. Alen Šćuric Purger8 February 2018 at 18:37

      OK, I will stop. Not because of so many arguments, witnesses inside company and historical evidence how same think was done before, but because you said so.

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    13. Alen, Swiss didnt destroy Darwin at all. It was dead few times earlier Afterwards it was hibernating under EY for 3 years, and finally sucked out by the same people who are today making PR for Adria.

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    14. Alen, just remember that jp employees who have more information than you write comments on this website too.

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    15. jp employees have no usable information about anything going on from the moment 4K took over. Purger operates with result of studies.

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  2. Lufthansa's orders.

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  3. Replies
    1. Not really. Western Germany is a lot more wealthy and higher yielding.

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    2. Yes and Paderborn is sandwiched between DUS and HAY. At least in Lodz they only had Warsaw to worry about.

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    3. NRW alone has 18 million inhabitants and is an industrial area with lots of business flyers. In the whole greater area of Lodz there are not more than 1 million.

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    4. Yes but it's not a virgin market. The whole region is well covered by numerous airports. How will Adria compete with all of them? Why should someone fly with them and not from DTM, HAJ or DUS?

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    5. @Nemjee: The idea is to do double daily ZRH. They do not have a business class, but could charge easily 400€ for a return ticket, as there would be enough demand if they leave PAD before 8:00 and leave ZRH after 20:00; The demand will be lower in the other direction but even less price sensitive. You will see it in their pricing that PAD-ZRH-PAD (same day) will be just below 400€ and ZRH-PAD-ZRH (same day) will be above 500€.

      They should be able to make it profitable just by those that need same day return.

      The demand for Vienna and London is rather uncertain. They will try this to utilize the plane and test demand. But I am not sure if that really helps, as the market for same day PAD-VIE-PAD is totally different than 11:30 am flights. I guess they will cancel VIE very soon.

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    6. On top of that, Wizz Air is launching VIE-DTM which is right next door to PAD. Then again, maybe this is a way for LH to make Wizz's life more difficult. Who knows..

      At the end of the day I am not too optimistic about this adventure. In my opinion JP needs to concentrate on LJU. Very few (small) airlines have managed to operate several hubs/focus cities.

      Delete
    7. + 1 AnonymousFebruary 8, 2018 at 1:22 PM

      For business trips time is crucial so people will pay more to fly from the closest airport they have.

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  4. In all fairness they also planned to operate out of Lugano and look how that went...

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    Replies
    1. They also announced base in Bern with new routes and 3 days later announced they were cancelling all those plans.

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  5. From the beginning I know that behind all of this is LH.

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  6. And just when I was happy they were focusing on LJU. They must be getting some subsidies to start flights from this city, like they did in Lodz.

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    Replies
    1. They have to do something with their Saabs

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  7. They shouldn't be criticized for trying. You should only crisize decisions which are repeated & failed ones rather ones which are different to existing ones.

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    Replies
    1. It is repeated since they tried this before and it failed.

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    2. Pristina didn't fail

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    3. Paderborn ain't no Pristina

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    4. It isn't but like someone says it is higher yielding for sure.

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    5. Lodz fail? Lodz didnt fail it ended when pso ended. Adria came out positively

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  8. Well let's hope for the best. These routes are mostly for feeding Star alliance (Lufthansa group) hubs, but in this situation this is it what Adria can get as member of Star alliance.

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  9. I'm just wondering how can this be profitable for JP? I mean they have to base crew there, they have to have some person on the ground there...

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  10. Adria always made the weirdest decisions :D

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    Replies
    1. Buying Darwin Airline and then bankrupting it is certainly on the top of the list.

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    2. Tbh, that wasn't Adria...

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    3. Sure it wasn't. That's why the Swiss are investigating where did millions disappear from Darwin's bank accounts between June and November 2017 when 4K was running the company.

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  11. Good, now they can rename that CRJ which they called Lodz to Paderborn

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    Replies
    1. Is that plane still named Lodz?

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    2. No it isn't. The plane is now in full Luxair livery and is wet leased to that company.

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    3. Interesting. Thanks.

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  12. Jesus, how random. Never even heard of that city. They better start Belgrade with one new Saab, from LJU of course.

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    Replies
    1. I don't think they will start BEG because of the codeshare with Air Serbia. I don't think the market is large enough for two players on that route. Although I would like them to start.

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    2. No chance for BEG while the have a codeshare with JU.

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    3. PAD-BEG. huh?

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    4. INI with Saab is perfect

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  13. I doubt that the Saabs will fly by SUTT

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    Replies
    1. If they don't come that would be a disaster for JP. They would be unable to launch any of these new routes.

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    2. Certification administration to operate this ac with SLO registration wont be finish. They will fly them with their CRJs at least in the first months, you will see

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    3. But will they have enough CRJs seeing as some are being wet-leased?

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    4. Yes, worst case they will use a CRJ in the beginning. Do they still have their old CR2 with 50 seats?

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    5. No, last one was sold in 2016.

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    6. More difficult to get SB's on JP's AOC is to get pilots for it. They will never ever operate all the remaining Saab fleet.

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  14. So there will be 1 CR7 at SUN, 2 CR9 at VIE an 1 S20 at PAD.
    Some more wet Lease? EW?

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    Replies
    1. What is SUN?

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    2. At this rate, they won't have any planes left in Slovenia soon.

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    3. Sun Valley, Idaho, USA :)

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    4. @anon 9:34: probabyly SCN, they are flying to TXL for Luxair

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  15. Impressive work from Adria, recognizing the potential of the Slovenian market and the need to expand into other routes. They've been very creative with their expansion and it looks like it is paying dividends.

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    Replies
    1. Where is it paying off dividends?

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    2. The only benefits by now are those given by Slovenian Government and those taken from Darwin's account.

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  16. come to Macedonia and open FRA,AMS & CDG!

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    Replies
    1. That ship has sailed.

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    2. Alen Šćuric Purger8 February 2018 at 10:22

      Of course it is not.

      If they open FRA and MUC for LH there is no any risk at all here. AMS and CDG not so sure, but can be done (especially that LH allow JP to have code-share on AF and KL).

      Here Wizz is not in advantage with flights to secondary airports as most of passengers to FRA, MUC, CDG and AMS are not P2P but connection one.

      Delete
    3. MUC it a great airport to transfer. However 64% of all MUC passengers are not transferring but OD.

      just for context: MUC has (slightly) more OD than the combined traffic of all exyu airports...

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    4. MUC is my favorite airport to transfer!

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    5. Alen Šćuric Purger8 February 2018 at 18:39

      Mine too.

      Delete
  17. Smart strategy to move to higher yield markets.

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  18. What's up with them doing so much in Germany. They will fly to Frankfurt, Munich, Hamburg and Dusseldorf this summer and now they are opening a base in Paderborn.

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    Replies
    1. Well the company is German owned.

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    2. Isn't 4K from Luxembourg?

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    3. That's just a cover because taxes in Luxembourg are extremely low. That's why half of US companies are registered there too. 4K is a company from Munich.

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    4. Didn't realize. Makes sense now.

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    5. Why not Germany? Why would they as a company limit themselves to a micro market like Slovenia?

      With your thinking Ryanair would have 30 aircraft, Wizz Air 10, etc.

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  19. I flew in and out of Billund recently and it was very interesting to see a busy airport with many major airlines in what could be described as the middle of nowhere. But if you think about it, it's actually surrounded by many small towns where people are rather entrepreneurial (and rich) and there is demand for both business and leisure travel.
    Perhaps they concluded that this airport has a similar potential.

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    Replies
    1. I think so too. The main thing here is the high yields they could have.

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  20. Adria can have sommer base on brac and open some new routes from there.

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    Replies
    1. Adria offers good connections via LJU. That’s enough for a small airport like BWK.

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    2. They should base a CRJ-700 in INI and start INI-LAX

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    3. You are not funny anon 05.42

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  21. "Adria Airways reportedly plans to launch three times weekly Paderborn/Lippstadt-London Southend and Paderborn/Lippstadt-Vienna services and 11 times weekly Paderborn/Lippstadt-Zurich service from Mar-2018"

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    Replies
    1. Can they do all this with one plane?

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    2. Yes, without a problem.

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    3. Alen Šćuric Purger8 February 2018 at 10:24

      Of course. One plane can make 21-28 rotation per week. And that is just 17 rotations. I presume they will have more flights or routes in near future (for instance they don't have enough passengers for Pristina base, so that plane in same time operate for Tirana)

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    4. If JP is smart I would use the S20 at PAD better. The Pad-Vienna flights could take over some LJUVIELJU legs of JP. Routing could be:
      PAD-VIE-LJU-VIE-PAD 3x weekly.
      That way JP saves a CRJ 3 weekly on LJUVIELJU rotations.
      The Saab based at PAD would then have 20 rotations a week total instead of 17.

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  22. In my opinion this summer expansion they're doing is going to fail badly. Their prices are too high for what they offer. I don't believe many people will buy fares that expensive.

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    Replies
    1. I don't think it will be a complete failure but I also don't think all the routes will work out and I think some will be cut by the end of summer.

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    2. when you add luggage to the price, they are not that expensive any more.
      And also those Saab seats are really comfortable

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    3. 270€ for a return flight to dusseldorf with the BASIC FARE that only allows 1 hand luggage is too much.

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    4. @anon 11:27: to much for you!

      guess what, not every company is only thinking about you when they plan their business.

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    5. If you fly with a 50-seater it means that you have higher costs per seat. So (average) price for the customer will have to be higher, if you leave price dumping aside.
      270 EUR for a long S20 flight is rather ok (of course not if you are used to Wizz 89 EUR return).

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  23. It will be a very interesting summer for Adria.

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  24. Total waste of time. This airlines doesn't know what they are doing. Stick to LJU and develop it instead of spreading yourself thin with tiny bases elsewhere!!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Agree completely. Focus on LJU!

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    2. Why try make a profit by expanding and utilising aircraft in large markets?

      Better to stay home and slowly die when LCCs finally come to LJU.

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    3. But none of those expansions in larger markets have worked so far.

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    4. so opening 7 new routes this summer is how they arent developing LJU? it looks like they can do two things at once.

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    5. Company should try to make profit anywhere they can. They think they have found a niche in the market so why not try to use expensive plane in a high yielding airport? Good luck to them!

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  25. Try them all!
    Why not Rostock–Laage Airport or even better Heringsdorf Airport?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. There are gorgeous and expensive beaches up there in summer. Not a bad idea!

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  26. Who will fly from Paderborn/Lippstadt to London Southend?! I can't get this one.

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    Replies
    1. Adria Airways.

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    2. There is a large british military presence that travels between these two airport.

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  27. But If they are going to have a base in Paderborn, this means that cabin crew will be from Germany or they will have Slovenians there in Germany?

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    Replies
    1. It will be European crew. If I remember correctly they were recruiting through some Swiss agency? Pilots I assume will be Slovenian.

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    2. Honestly, they better use Slovenes, they are cheaper :)

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  28. Adria will slowly but surely replace Augsburg!

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    Replies
    1. and just like then LH gets the feed and the losses are paid by the other company.

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    2. One can only congratulate LH for this outsourcing.

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  29. Interesting strategy they have going. Let's see if it will work

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  30. Well let's hope for the best. At the end of the day Adria is a regional airline with a very small base of potential travellers on scheduled routes out from Slovenia. In this situation there is just no other way for it than to expand on other markets too.

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  31. PAD will probably subsidize the flights and that's why Adria is interested. Remember that the Lodz flights were also subsidized and as soon as those ended they stopped flying from Lodz. Also PAD lost a lot of passengers because Niki ceased operations.

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  32. Kada su vec raspolozeni za eksperimentisanje mogli bi probati i liniju Paderborn -Niš mislim da ima neistraženi potencijal.

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    Replies
    1. Хахаха ех само да Визер не лети Ниш-Дортмунд.

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  33. These are all PR stunts (Saabs, new bases, expansion etc.). They are trying to offload the company to a naive buyer, but no one is that naive.

    They don't have enough crews for the existing number of CRJ's and A320's, they cannot find pilots for Saabs (no one has the type rating) - they are recruiting FO's, but the numbers are way too low for the planned expansion, they cannot get any direct entry captains.

    The bubble is about the burst, given the fact that the company is not making profit.

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    Replies
    1. That about sums it up. They "streamlined" the business during the first year, then they posted a profit the following year (thanks to some ingenious ideas such as serving free water, reducing transfer time in LJU and selling Adria's brand name) and now it's time to expand the company. A prime example of a "successful" turnaround.

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  34. Well they never stop to amaze.

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  35. they are doing good till they run....

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  36. Southend Airport gives swift access to London via its own railway station. Up to 8 trains an hour cover the journey to central London in fifty minutes. I doubt that many people will want to visit Southend but the swift access to London will appeal. Southend is already incidentally an easyJet and flyBE base. Adria flew into Southend from Maribor for one season only in 2015. Maybe Paderbron route will be more successful.

    ReplyDelete
  37. People are talking about that additional Combat Gear Is Being Stored With The Stockpile Inside Norwegian Caves Illuminated by fluorescent lights aligning the ceiling and they have all heard about this news from the active military base website.

    ReplyDelete

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