Air Serbia is in advanced talks over the potential introduction of flights to Miami, Serbia’s Ambassador to the United States, Marko Djurić, has said, noting the city will become the airline’s next destination in the United States following talks with Ralph Cutie, the Director and CEO of the Miami-Dade Aviation Department. Speaking to the Miami Herald, Mr Djurić, said, “Miami is next in the US. Discussions about the new Miami service have been taking place since at least last year. Air Serbia is pretty far in talks with MIA [Miami International Airport]. I think it will happen this year. If the carrier gets new long-haul airplanes by April, then the Miami flight could be added fairly quickly”. The Ambassador previously noted ticket sales for the new service could begin by the end of the year.
Air Serbia had previously said its third destination in North America would be added in 2025, with either Miami or Toronto to be introduced, while 2024 would see the expansion of its China network. It has not commented on the latest remarks made by the Ambassador. “Air Serbia is in the final stages of analysing the business case, but there is strong political will from the government to make the new service to and from MIA happen. Air Serbia would start with two to three flights a week and then hopefully ramp up. MIA is doing a really good job in convincing people to come to Miami. They are really making sure airlines feel like they are welcome”, Mr Djurić, who is expected to take on a new high-ranking post in government, said.
An estimated 50.000 Serbian - Americans live in Florida. However, the Ambassador said the airline anticipates catering for transfer passengers on the route as well, particularly the large Jewish community in the Sunshine State. The country will open a new consulate in the city later this year, with both diplomatic and trade representatives. It will be followed by the opening of a new consulate in San Francisco, complementing existing ones in New York City and Chicago. “The government is very determined to step up economic, political, cultural and all other ties with the US, We know that the economy of Florida is a good match for Serbia when it comes to opportunities”, Mr Djurić said.
So the plan is to get a330s in april? That's QUICK - we don't even know the MSNs
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't hold his word for it. All JU has said is that they have secured 2 additional widebodies.
DeleteMarek thought the A330 will come before summer but there is no way as these planes have not flown in a long time. It will take at least until autumn to fix them.
Delete^ You don't know even which ones are coming. Yet you know they haven't flown in a long time and need to be fixed... Some poeple here.
DeleteSure, Marek, Mali and Djuric know nothing about new widebodies. Luckily, we have you to open our eyes.
DeleteWhy are they only considering the A330? Why not another plane type for long haul operations?
DeleteThis is what Marek said about the A330 last year
Delete“For us, I call the A330 the ATR of the wide-bodies. It is the perfect aircraft for an airline of our size. It is a very profitable machine, especially with the lease rates we have since Covid”
A350s would be nice additions.
DeleteA330 arrival is much advanced than people think.
DeleteFrankly, with so much talk I think they're already in service...
DeleteA350 is the next stage. For LAX and JFK instead of 2 daily flights. I believe sometime 2026, before Expo
DeleteAir Serbia will never get A350s with Marek there. He's a new plane hater and openly hates on all new, good aircraft while picking up 15 year old ruined aircraft to use for JU (say YU-APO for example, economy on there is falling apart)
DeleteIt has been repeated time and again that mid-life aircraft on 5 year lease is more affordable aproach than lease of brand new aircraft. Not defending anyone anywhere, such business approach is not without merit, especially if the money is tight. Even Delta acquired the whole fleets of used MD-80s and B717s and used them thoroughly.
DeleteI believe everyone would love to see A350s in Air Serbia colors, however, one has to be able to afford the plane.
YU-APO was 8 yo when delivered to JU, not 15.
Deletehttps://www.exyuaviation.com/2022/09/photos-air-serbias-newest-a320-to-enter.html?m=1
YU-APS was 12 yo when delivered.
https://www.exyuaviation.com/2023/04/air-serbia-takes-delivery-of-third-a320.html?m=1
Average age of the ATR fleet 8,8 years, with YU-ALZ being the oldest at 10,8 years.
Not sure what you are on about.
Regarding new aircraft, his reason for avoiding new technology aircraft is not without reason.
https://www.exyuaviation.com/2024/02/wizz-to-cancel-seven-ex-yu-routes-as.html?m=1
https://www.businesstravelnewseurope.com/Air-Travel/Ryanair-cuts-winter-schedule-due-to-aircraft-delivery-delays
A350 would be great but airbus has a huge backlog, so they would be waiitng for a while for the plane, then there is the issue of what do if something goes wrong, crashed economy, war, political issues and then JU would be stuck with a aircraft they cant use.
Deleteleasing aircraft is just the more stable option, plenty of industry knowledge and experience with the aircraft they can learn from others on its use already.
the other option that could be interesting is boeing widebodies. yes its more cost to diversify with training an everything but would make it easier to find planes they want if they open up to the other manufacturer
In case of war, earthquake or flood they would have a lot of unusable planes. All of them actually.
DeleteWe all want to see new planes operating for JU but i think that this strategy is the best for them right now as they are still growing and still have many things to improve. At this time the A330 is the best option for them, its easer and faster to secure then new planes which need more time to be delivered plus they already have trained crew for the A330s. OS for example is still using the 767s and they have been on the long-haul market for quite some time. JU is now starting do develop the long-haul flights and that is enough to begin with. Also we never know if there will be some problem with the new planes in the future, just like the case with max versions, the p&w on the neos and so on. Why rushing to spend money on new planes when you are still in position of growing. Once they are more stable then ordering new planes and changing the fleet is easy task to do. The problem is that we must find the negativity in everything good that is going to happen to any of us.
DeleteWhen i say they start to develop the longhaul market i didnt mean that they are new to it. I know that JFK has been operating for years and that now they have theee longhaul routes so keep calm.
Delete@17:33. the 767-300ER could be useful for JU if they wanted to. it has nearly the same range as the A330-200 but has about 90 less seats. allowing to launch the long haul routes which might not have the same demand as JFK or ORD.
DeleteOk, I think we can safely say they have chosen MIA over Toronto.
ReplyDeleteSmart choice.
DeleteToronto will come eventually too.
DeleteToronto may seem like a tough route to start but will pay off in the long run.
DeleteWhy doesn't Air Transat start YYZ-BEG? JU obviously does not want to.
Delete^ Has anyone even animated them to start the flight? Doubt BEG has established any contact with them.
DeleteThere are direct flights to Toronto from Miami
DeleteHopefully Transat or AC launch it (but knowing Serbian people they won't want to pay AC fares so Transat's ultra squeezed, no legroom low cost will work perfectly)
DeleteReason for Toronto being pushed back has Trudeau to be blamed, if he can freeze the bank accounts of his own truckers, image what he could do to a foreign airline
DeletePerhaps Canada and YYZ should do more to attract foreign carriers. High fees and limiting bilaterals don't seem to be appealing for airlines on both ends. I'm sure if JU were to ever launch YYZ they would want more than 2 pw in the peak summer months.
DeleteCanada and YYZ are protective of AirCanada, so it is not in their interest to attract foreign carriers. Their lack of action on softening the bilaterals are speaking more loudly than any publicity discourse.
DeleteAir Serbia could have started Toronto in 2018 when bilaterals were done. By now it would have been possible to demonstrate the need to go beyond two weekly.
DeleteAir Serbia flights to TSN operated just one weekly most of the time since launch and never went higer than two weekly. Chicago operates two weekly most of the year. New China destination(s) will likely start with one weekly and are very likely to stay at two weekly. Frequency limitation is not the problem for Air Serbia to start Toronto.
13:53 Air Serbia has secured slots for 3 weekly in Guanhgzhou and 2 weekly flights in Shanghai, just so you know.
DeleteGuangzhou*
DeleteSame weekly frequency limit for Shaghai and Toronto then.
DeleteShanghai has been he busiest unserved route out of BEG for years based on P2P demand and considering the free trade agreement between Serbia and China, it is likely to have significant cargo volumes too.
DeleteOnce you prove that 2 weekly frequency limit would be the same for Shanghai and Toronto, the other side quietly switches conversation to busiest unserved route out of BEG. When you use that argument to show Toronto is about 4 times busier unserved route out of BEG than Miami, the other side quietly switches conversation to yet another topic.
DeleteIf the Miami choice was clearly superior over Toronto, there would be no need to shift topic all the time.
Again you need to calm down, channel your disappointment elsewhere and stop relying on data from 2019. Not only is it 5 years old but the world has significantly changed since. At the end of the day, you rely on information for P2P demand based on a single ticket, taking no consideration of transfer traffic, passengers who may be travelling on two separate tickets etc. The airline has a much better insight into how numbers change, they have a much better insight into costs, seasonality, cargo demand, start up costs, incentives from airport operators etc then you
DeleteBasically, the guy is arguing that the airline should not dare launch anything else but Toronto because it suits him best.
DeleteIn my mind, cargo capacity on China routes provides more sustainable route development potential than Canadian VFR seasonal highly directional traffic. It would be great to be able to fly to Toronto to non stop from Belgrade again (or even Vancouver), but I would also like to have decent frequencies and pricing. Not to mention Visa requirements. US visa is getting easier and easier to get, Canada is not exactly in the same league.
DeleteAnonymous16:43 Numbers have also significantly changed since 2015 for BEG-JFK demand. Once nonstop was launched, passenger numbers soared and would likely increase for YYZ-BEG once nonstop is launched.
DeleteLooking back, it now seems Air Serbia evaluating Chicago/Toronto and then evaluating Miami/Toronto was more like Air Serbia evaluating just Chicago/Miami.
Alot of talk about pax numbers but nothing on cargo as @eight pointed out. It was mainly cargo that pushed JU to decide on ORD over YYZ, which Marek mentioned in an interview. TSN was able to sell out flights within hours of launching ticket sales, something neither JFK nor ORD has done, and neither will YYZ. Pax numbers isn't the only reason for launching additional routes to China, cargo plays a big role. China is also alot more flexible with additional frequencies, unlike Canada which has shown time and time again to be stubborn and inflexible with frequencies, despite evident demand for additional frequencies, all with the goal of protecting AC.
DeleteRead Anon 13:53 for frequency info.
Delete"MIA is doing a really good job in convincing people to come to Miami. They are really making sure airlines feel like they are welcome"
ReplyDeleteI have heard this on an unrelated forum. Seems MIA offers generous start up incentives.
It is also likely cheaper to fly to than YYZ.
DeleteFrom BEG, MIA is 2800km longer return trip than YYZ. Longer trip means more fuel, more hours for the crew and NAV charges.
DeleteDemand from Belgrade for Toronto and back is about four times higher than for Miami. You can sell a lot more tickets for YYZ than for MIA.
DeleteAgain, it matters very little if the yields are not there. Also, it seems you have a very rudimentary way of concluding whether a route will make money or not. The airline looks at various aspects, from airport costs, fuel costs at airports, year-round demand, seasonal demand, transfer point demand, indirect competition, fares and pricing etc.
DeleteThere is no more charges in MIA, landing fees are 40% cheaper in MIA then YYZ. Fuel is almost half price then Canada and MTC contract for them is way cheaper in MIA.Canadian economy is going down the hill very fast. People can not afford o pay basic bills and homeless people are taking over some cities in Canada. They have to really be careful with lunching YYZ.
DeleteNo point in having conversation at Embry-Riddle grad level when news article reveals decision to pick Miami over Toronto was not about fuel costs or seasonality but strong political will from the government.
DeleteThere is no need to be rude purely because you are disappointed that they are not launching Toronto momentarily. If you wish, you might want to read what Marek said about why Miami makes more sense for them than Toronto for the time being.
DeleteNot rude, just quoting the fact from today's article - strong political will to launch MIA.
DeleteInteresting that you didn't quote, or take into consideration, previous statements made by Marek.
DeleteMost of those (on evaluation of ORD vs YYZ and similar) were debunked here in the past. Regular site vistors saw them time and again.
DeleteYou've debunked literally nothing as you have absolutely no access to any data, numbers or facts and are being purely led by emotion. But ok, you just wrote you know better than the CEO and the entire company. Modest of you.
DeleteIf Toronto is much better choice, why doesn't Canadian carrier launch it? They could even combine it with Zagreb flights to mitigate the risks! Yet, they don't!
DeleteRoutes such as YYZ-GRU-SCL are extremely rare nowadays so YYZ-ZAG-BEG might not be ideal.
Delete"Air Canada has considered launching operations to Belgrade, however, a restrictive Air Service Agreement, limiting carriers to two weekly flights, is considered a deterrent"
Quote from:
https://www.exyuaviation.com/2022/10/president-air-serbia-plans-toronto-as.html
Mid to long term, A321XLR will be arriving to airline fleets in Canada. It is my understanding they might enable airlines to launch more services to Europe or free up some longer range aircraft. It will be up to airlines to decide and publish their plans.
@Anon 15:00 "as you have absolutely no access to any data, numbers or facts"
DeleteCan you prove this?
Yes, based on your baseless arguments.
Deletepeople shouldnt forget that YYZ is also very close to ORD and JFK, so people can always go from canada to US and transfer for the flight to BEG as it would be easier for them than transferring at amsterdam or frankfurt. maybe JU considered this to not take away passangers from their ORD, JFK routes. Wheras MIA can be access of the south slavic/balkans nations from latin america and southern states of america.
Deletealso people may be complaining about the political push for MIA, but if you think about it for just longer than a second its actually a reason why the route will be more successful. if the politicians from Serbia and USA together with businesses will cooperate and organise to boost tourism and trade then this will mean its much more likely to succeed over YYZ.
didnt think that needed explaining if two governements are supporting a project that its more likely to work, since they both want to be making money.
Most of the arguments for Toronto over Miami were backed up by links to published data, numbers and facts. Regular visitors can find arguments and facts here, no need to repeat. Toronto airport being more expensive than Miami is the only advantage for Miami that still stands.
DeleteThe "facts" that you talk about are all pre-Covid numbers and are all exclusively based on P2P demand on a single ticket, taking no consideration of transfer traffic, passengers who may be travelling on two separate tickets etc. The airline has a much better insight into how numbers change, they have a much better insight into costs, seasonality, cargo demand, start up costs, incentives from airport operators etc then you.
DeleteFrankly, I do understand that you are disappointed but channel your frustration elsewhere. The airline hasn't actually announced Miami. The article points out that the only official statement from the airline is that it is considering one of the two. The airline will launch the destination that is in the best interest of its finances.
Pre-Covid numbers??? Here is the list from 2024:
DeletePVG
YYZ
HKG
LAX
CAN
SYD
MEL
MIA
from:
https://www.exyuaviation.com/2024/01/belgrade-airport-eyes-long-haul-network.html
Toronto still way ahead of Miami. But I get it: airline will launch the destination it wants regardless of what is presented in comments. Message is clear: put your seat in the upright position, fasten your seat belt and be quiet.
That's not a list from 2024. You can't have a list of indirect traffic flow for 2024 in January 2024 🤦🏻♂️
DeleteBest ignore. He will cry and be a drama queen because he wants to fly nonstop from Toronto. He doesen't care about anything else or any other factors.
DeleteList was published in 2024. Ex Yu didn't publish the date.
Delete"He doesen't care about anything else or any other factors. "
I do, that's why I post numbers, facts and data to back up my arguments. What I hear in return is mostly "airline knows better".
The CEO of JU said that Toronto is more a seasonal destination and relies on diaspora mostly, while MIA is a year-round destination and a touristic place. I personally know people who fly from Skopje to Miami or Tampa via LHR and FRA, now they can fly with JU as well.
DeleteAir Serbia can and should start Toronto as seasonal destination, nothing stops them. There are more tourists going from Belgrade to Thailand than Miami.
DeleteIf they start flights to Miami, they should work on a codeshare with American Airlines. I know they have an interline already.
ReplyDeleteIs it likely to have two US codeshare partners?
DeleteWhy not?
DeleteThey should also be thinking of a codeshare with a South American airline. LATAM or Avianca.
DeleteNothing indicates significant demand for potential Air Serbia transfers from MIA to South America. I would be surprised to see double digit percentage for those transfers.
DeleteI'm glad how you have insight into transfer passengers for before and beyond points from both BEG and MIA. In fact, I'm sure you have better insight than the company itself which has software that costs millions that pulls data from booking engines to show them precisely where people are flying to.
DeleteJust look at miniscule percentage for Air Serbia transfers beyond JFK and ORD.
DeleteThe percentage is far from miniscule. Please don't make things up purely because of your dissapointment that they are not launching Toronto (momentarily).
DeleteAir Serbia forte is in pulling feed from destinations in the wider ex Yu region onto long haul flights. That percentage is far from miniscule and several times higher than small percentage of transfers beyond points in the US. Numbers were published here in the past.
DeleteJU already has routes to the the airports in europe with the biggest connection to latin america. they fly to Porto, Madrid, Barcelona. if there is data about the transfers from these airports to BEG then that can be used as an indicator if there will be transfers on the MIA route.
DeleteUS airports do not have the concept of airside transfer, so anyone travelling to Latin America would need a US visa + to clear US immigration and customs + to recheck their baggage in order to connect onwards. That makes it a highly unattractive option vs. transferring at a European hub.
DeleteSledeće zime bismo mogli da imamo:
ReplyDeleteJFK 3X
ORD 3X
MIA 2X
TSN 2X
PVG 2X
CAN 2X
1 A330 bi stalno mogao biti na redovnom servisu i ne bi morali da angažuju Vamos.
If someone asked me a few years ago which city in the US Air Serbia would be flying to next, Miami definitely would not have been on my guess :D
ReplyDeleteWell, their long-haul development depends ONLY on arrival or 3rd, 4th and 5th A330.
ReplyDeleteSo we might see Miami before we see Shanghai/Guangzhou 🤔.
ReplyDeleteThat would be stupid. One A330 could serve both chinese routes and other could fill second daily JFK on selected days and MIA as well. Any unnecessary postponing of service may give advantage to some other air line.
DeleteIt seems that unfortunately nobody still knows when third A332 will arrive...
ReplyDeleteWe need Canada, but Miami would be a very nice addition.
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure eventually both will be part of the network
DeleteMiami is a year-round destination and gateway to South America. Good choice.
ReplyDeleteExcellent news
ReplyDeleteNice to see North American market developing for JU.
ReplyDeleteAnyone know how long would a nonstop flight from Belgrade take to Miami?
ReplyDeleteAbout 11 hours from Beg and 10 hours from Mia.
DeleteMaybe they could fly summer seasonal to Toronto and then winter seasonal to Miami?
ReplyDeleteThat makes no sense
DeleteHow many cities did JAT covered in the USA while in its peak?
ReplyDelete6 - New York, Chicago. Los Angeles, Cleveland, Detroit and Pittsburgh.
DeleteStill a while to go until they can reach that number of US destinations.
DeleteNo need for Cleveland no more Slovenes. Detroit is dead. Pittsburgh after LAX.
DeleteInterestingly it says in the article they plan to open a consulate in San Francisco. This is a potential future route.
DeleteI assume there is a large Serbian population in the Bay area?
DeleteCan someone explain why Pittsburgh?
DeleteBiggest number of Serbs in US lives in Ohio. Not in Chicago. Two orthodox monasteries there. That was not daily flights in that time. Detroit was alive in that time 40 years ago.
Deleteabout 2-3 years ago San francisco was talked about by the president of serbia as a point of interest for the national business, tourism and diaspora. so maybe San francisco will be another routes developed from the political interest.
DeleteSuck it up. Stop spamming just because you are disappointed about Toronto. They will launch it eventually. Miami was mentioned by the airline long before any politician
DeleteJesus Christ.
Anon@10:13 there is still a significant Slovene population in Cleveland.
DeleteBro @16:37 Who mentioned Toronto. Chill dawg!
DeleteAll four North American routes are in plannning/development/negotiation, so people please CHILL...
DeleteWhen I say all four I mean Miami, Toronto, Los Angeles and San Francisco.
Vancouver was (is) also on the table but for after 2027
Would be really nice to see Miami. It would be a nice connection to Central and South America
ReplyDeleteIt will be difficult to compete against Turkish Airlines on MIA route.
ReplyDeleteBy that logic, it is difficult for them to compete anywhere, since Turkish flies literally everywhere.
Delete+1
DeleteIt wont be difficult cause JU offers better prices on their longhaul flights then TK. If i go to New York tomorrow i will surely fly with Air Serbia rather then TK, its cheaper, its faster, its more logical for me and it will make fill like home even though i am from macedonia.
DeleteJU makes me fill like home too
DeleteReally looking forward to the launch. Can't wait to see Air Serbia in sunny Miami :)
ReplyDeleteWaiting for the CEO to announce something official...
ReplyDelete+1
DeleteWhen could flights be launched realistically?
ReplyDeleteWinter 2024/25
DeleteMore likely summer 2025.
DeleteHigh season in Florida is winter. So W24/25 would make sense.
DeleteMiami is slowly taking the throne for business and overall living in States so good choice. Good luck
ReplyDelete+1
DeleteIt is time to refurbish ARB and ARC before taking anything else, both cabin interiors look dirty and tired. Not well maintained at all.
ReplyDeleteYou have flown both recently?
DeleteJFK back in October 2023
Delete12:48 I think YU-ARC will be refurbished by the beginning of the summer season.
DeleteNow we have official confirmation Miami launch was a political decision: “there is strong political will from the government to make the new service to and from MIA happen".
ReplyDeleteOpening a new Consulate is not a justification. There is already a Consulate in Toronto.
An estimated 50.000 Serbian - Americans live in Florida - far more diaspora from Serbia and ex Yu lives in Ontario.
Airline anticipates catering for transfer passengers on the route as well, particularly the large Jewish community - great, but there is a very large large Jewish community in Toronto area, and Air Serbia still didn't return to TLV.
The other day someone was claiming that the government wanted Toronto but that the airline was persuading them that they should start Miami instead. Make up your mind.
DeleteHe only mentioned Jewish community because Marko Djuric himself is Jewish and has strong ties to the Jewish community. In reality the star transfer passenger prize are Russians and that what has probably be one of the deciding factors. They can fill these flights year round with Russian transfers.
DeleteThere is larger community of Russian origin in Toronto area than in Miami, if those transfers are supposed to be justification for starting the service.
DeleteThe justification is that they did a business case for each destination, which shows them where they can make more money. They certainly did more through research then your guesses and predictions.
DeleteLet's not go into a long record of Air Serbia failed business cases for destinations that were started and then cancelled or turned to seasonal. At least we now know MIA was decision not made purely on business numbers but also political will.
DeleteI guess there was no political will so the government renegotiated the ASA with Canada to even make it possible for them to launch flights there. Please channel your anger and dissapointment into something useful rather than make things up.
DeletePolitical will changes over time:
Deletehttps://www.exyuaviation.com/2022/10/president-air-serbia-plans-toronto-as.html
Cleveland next like back in the day lol
ReplyDeleteI believe with the opening of the consulate and economic section they are trying to utilize the flights to attract more modern technology companies from Florida. Kinda smart.
ReplyDeleteTech is stronger in Cali, NY, Boston, Seattle, even Texas.
DeleteIts over for Cali and soon NY.. Texas &Florida is new future for USA
DeleteThis bickering of wannabe experts is so entertaining. Can't wait for that Lagos flight and a minimum of 200 comments.
ReplyDeleteAmerican Airlines could launch Miami instead of JU, they have a base there. In the future, Dallas and Los Angeles could be nice adds too.
ReplyDeleteAA would be a good partner to team up with on the US side inhelping the JFK and ORD flights in addition to MIA but JU would have to do the actual flying and settling for a codeshare. MIA is very much a global destination and is the principal Gateway to Latin & South America as well as the Caribbean but the flights would need to focus on the traffic that originates in Belgrade and Eastern Europe. Port of Miami is also attractive as it is the primary Cruise Port for all the major Cruiselines which will draw the Eastern Europe. AirSerbia would be a potential new addition to ONEWORLD with what they bring to the Alliance. They need to start with small additions.
Delete> However, the Ambassador said the airline anticipates catering for transfer passengers on the route as well, particularly the large Jewish community in the Sunshine State
ReplyDeleteDon't forget the Cubans!